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Tecness2
11-25-2012, 08:36 PM
Okay hey! I'm making another thread about balancing ideas! Why? Because I like to.

Units:
Flying Crossbowmen: Make them slower (Magikill slow) and have about 10% less HP.
Wingadon: Make them slower (5% slower than an archer) and reduce damage by 25%.

Bombers: Need an upgrade that increases their damage & health by 50%.


Medusa: The cooldown on the stone ability, should be increased from 800 to 900.
Skeleton Mage: The reaper ability, needs it's cooldown increased by 33%
Crawlers: Health decrease slightly(about 10%). With the speed upgrade, it's health increases by 20%.(So, it's 110% of normal)
Dead: It should cost only 50 mana. But have a SLIGHT range decrease.



Abilities/Upgrades:
Rage: The cost needs to be increased to 100 gold and 100 mana. It's currently 50/50. You can buy 1 miner, 2 swordwrath and start researching that within 40 seconds of the game starting.
Bomber upgrade: Read Above.
Flaming Arrow: It should be able to be charged up. By this, I mean, you should be able to do it say 3 times in a row, and then the next 3 arrows you fire, are flaming.
Magikill Upgrade: An upgrade that increase movement speed slightly, as well as casting speed (does nothing for cooldowns)
Monk Upgrade: An upgrade that increases the range of the monk's healing ability by 15%
Poison(Dead): It should be increased to 15 mana per usage.
Blazing Bolts: It should cost mana (10) each time it's used.
Wingadon Poison Arrow: It should get an ability, like the Archidon's, that requires it to be activated, that shoots a poisoned arrow, but this should have a reduced range. So the Wingadon has to get up close to use it.


All I got for now.
If you have any questions ABOUT THE SUGGESTIONS listed above, post below, and be specific(Don't just ask "WHY ARE YOU DOING THIS").

300noob
11-25-2012, 10:21 PM
Oh ya have got to be kidding...
Blazing bolt is not an ability, it's an upgrade.
speed decrease for both flying unit? oh c'mon...
Chaos already have lots of poison...don't need more...
crawler is cheaper than swordwrath so why do you want it to be stronger?
don't need increase in gold price because gold is limited...
deads cost even less? hell no! dude, a dead can even kill a albowtross with blazing bolt....
i think they put the mage's spell cast time like that so it can fit to the words he says when he casts the spells
meric....should make them attack passively and attack when ordered to prevent charging infront of the army during a fight....



For now, fixing the bug and reducing the lag are much more important.

Seadefen
11-25-2012, 10:48 PM
Poisonous arrows: no because as they spawns cheaplier and faster, they should be weaker. Balancing means there are strategies for both sides to win, not 2 sides are exactly copies of eachothers, with different appears.
Btw, poisons s much more advantageous than fire, cos ones wounded by fire can retreat a little and hide behind companions and keep shooting. Neither can a poisoned one.


Flying unit's moving speed is OK atm I guess, not that slower than archers coz in a long map, they will surely die after realizing that the enemy has spearton shield + some few archers, before getting back into base to get reinforcement. I meant the battle will become less versatile, but just sending units up and watch if they die and buy another unit to replace.

The reaper skill: I hate it. Really hate it. @@ Maybe it's the only thing of Chaos that can rape me atm so I guess it's almost balanced. (I'm an Order player.)

Blazing bolt's mana cost? Nah no need, 400 golds at the beginning is already a big hurt in the economy.

Crawler's recent speed is already hard to be countered. If it increases 10 more % then they may dodge all arrows, or sword, or even slow spells, well, no damage at all while running. I agree with the idea that decrease their starting speed, so that they won't annoy the other's miners as early and effectively as they are doing. But just -10%.

Bobmer: wait, I though they can only suicide? Do they have other abilities? Do they need health?

Azxc
11-26-2012, 01:26 AM
I think albowtross is too weak, he can easily pwned by Order Giant or simply archers and zombies...
So don't decrease their hp
And blazing bolt is so expensive (400 gold) so no mana cost plz :(

For Magikill, I think he talked too much before he casts spells.... his targets should have already run away =.=
So, increase his casting speed, same as Medusa

_Ai_
11-26-2012, 02:54 AM
clerics to heal more or increased healing rate
tower spawn have less hp then trained ones

petmuju
11-26-2012, 04:24 AM
I think Allbowtross is slow enough. It takes him 24 arrows(without blazing bolts) to kill a speaton.
Blazing Bolts: But it's passive!
Wingadon Poison Arrow: Nope, too much poison already. Even a dead killed my archers easily without effort!

Since deads throw their own guts, they should run out of hp easily unless it auto-regenerates as soon as he rips out his guts! O_o

Seadefen
11-26-2012, 04:57 AM
I think albowtross is too weak, he can easily pwned by Order Giant or simply archers and zombies...
So don't decrease their hp
And blazing bolt is so expensive (400 gold) so no mana cost plz :(

For Magikill, I think he talked too much before he casts spells.... his targets should have already run away =.=
So, increase his casting speed, same as Medusa

Yeah indeed, when I started to hear the talkative enemy Magikill say "Venomom suprieure" or smthing..., I just retreated my units and they all dodged the poison spray, even the slowest giant dodged, just because the talktive old man also needs to brandish his staff after the talk.

Tecness2
11-26-2012, 05:44 AM
Blazing bolt is not an ability, it's an upgrade.
speed decrease for both flying unit? oh c'mon...
Chaos already have lots of poison...don't need more...
crawler is cheaper than swordwrath so why do you want it to be stronger?
don't need increase in gold price because gold is limited...
deads cost even less? hell no! dude, a dead can even kill a albowtross with blazing bolt....
i think they put the mage's spell cast time like that so it can fit to the words he says when he casts the spells
meric....should make them attack passively and attack when ordered to prevent charging infront of the army during a fight....

People don't seem to get, Wingadon is the chaos version of the archidon and the dead is the chaos version of the Flying crossbowman. Why does order get something that costs 400 gold and increases damage afterwards, and costs absolutely nothing to use, while chaos has to use 300 gold to research it, and then 10 mana each time afterwards.

Flying units have an immunity against most ground troops, they shouldn't be as strong as the currently are. 2/3rds of the game can't even hit them -_-

The Chaos race are the masters of poison, they should have a lot of it.

Did you even read the suggestion? MAKE THE CRAWLER WEAKER. After upgrading, which is like 50 gold and 200 mana, it goes a health increase with its normal speed increase.

I have no idea what this is referring too.

A Dead SHOULD be able to kill a flying crossbowman with ease.

Okay? That doesn't change the fact it gets a lot of Magikill's killed.

I don't get what the first part of this is...Also, if you put them on hold position, they don't move up but still heal.

Poisonous arrows: no because as they spawns cheaplier and faster, they should be weaker. Balancing means there are strategies for both sides to win, not 2 sides are exactly copies of eachothers, with different appears.
Btw, poisons s much more advantageous than fire, cos ones wounded by fire can retreat a little and hide behind companions and keep shooting. Neither can a poisoned one.


Flying unit's moving speed is OK atm I guess, not that slower than archers coz in a long map, they will surely die after realizing that the enemy has spearton shield + some few archers, before getting back into base to get reinforcement. I meant the battle will become less versatile, but just sending units up and watch if they die and buy another unit to replace.

The reaper skill: I hate it. Really hate it. @@ Maybe it's the only thing of Chaos that can rape me atm so I guess it's almost balanced. (I'm an Order player.)

Blazing bolt's mana cost? Nah no need, 400 golds at the beginning is already a big hurt in the economy.

Crawler's recent speed is already hard to be countered. If it increases 10 more % then they may dodge all arrows, or sword, or even slow spells, well, no damage at all while running. I agree with the idea that decrease their starting speed, so that they won't annoy the other's miners as early and effectively as they are doing. But just -10%.

Bobmer: wait, I though they can only suicide? Do they have other abilities? Do they need health?
As I said, the chaos race are the masters of poison, they should have a lot of poison, but I changed it a bit.

...Well, I don't have an answer for that, but I do have a question. Why are you sending a semi-expensive unit as a scout? Why not a swordwrath.

It's currently a bit overpowered. With good enough control, you can take control of one unit, indefinitely, for an unlimited amount of time, using only 2 skeleton mages. This nerf would require 3! :p

Well, I could say the same about the poison guts 300 gold cost, and 10 mana cost each time it's used, but other than that, why are you getting blazing bolts early game anyway?

This idea is not a speed increase, just a health increase. There is currently an upgrade that increases speed (NOT pack mentality), this upgrade would increase health as well as its standard speed.*

They need more health because 2 arrows can kill him :p. At least make it 3 after upgraded.

I think albowtross is too weak, he can easily pwned by Order Giant or simply archers and zombies...
So don't decrease their hp
And blazing bolt is so expensive (400 gold) so no mana cost plz :(

For Magikill, I think he talked too much before he casts spells.... his targets should have already run away =.=
So, increase his casting speed, same as Medusa
...THEY SHOULD BE GETTING "PWNED" BY ALL THESE UNITS. They are some of the only units that can actually attack them -_-

Poison guts is also expensive at 300 gold and 10 mana each time it's used, and since the dead is the chaos' standard archer, it's used a lot more than blazing bolts.

Well, the talking speed of both is the same, the difference is, the Medusa's action takes less time. Her hair moves forward and she spits poison on the ground. The Magikill has to raise his staff and then throw air forward.


I think Allbowtross is slow enough. It takes him 24 arrows(without blazing bolts) to kill a speaton.
Blazing Bolts: But it's passive!
Wingadon Poison Arrow: Nope, too much poison already. Even a dead killed my archers easily without effort!
Since deads throw their own guts, they should run out of hp easily unless it auto-regenerates as soon as he rips out his guts! O_o
How does the flying crossbowman being slow, affect how many hits it takes him to kill a unit THAT CAN NOT ATTACK HIM.

Yes, that's what I want to change.

A dead is armored, while an Archidon is not.

That would be funny."How did your dead die?" "Oh, he threw too many guts..."


Having strong air units that can only be attacked by 1/3rd of the game is like going into a CoD game with a perk that makes you bullet proof, while your character is a hand-to-hand & Melee weapon combat master.

Dracus94
11-26-2012, 03:16 PM
I side with tec on this one. Well kinda.
Albowtross should have a slight health decrease, but they shouldn't move as slow as a magikill -_-

MiamiBigAL
11-26-2012, 06:19 PM
I'm not sure about how it all balances out, but the suggestions aren't actually all that bad.

Overall, they would demand more micromanagement to use.

Tecness2
11-26-2012, 07:18 PM
I'm not sure about how it all balances out, but the suggestions aren't actually all that bad.

Overall, they would demand more micromanagement to use.
It requires more micro to be great at, but less to actually use(Like press the attack button).

300noob
11-26-2012, 10:27 PM
Again....chaos don't need that much poison...already have a lot
ya arguement over albowtross and deads don't make any sense. blazing bolt is a passive upgrade, not a ability...the deads is ability....and it can turn the tide when used right.
crawler CAN handle up to 3 hits from albow tross arrows with blazing bolt not 2 and could be up to 4-5 because the run speed make ranged units misses.
something with the price of 300 gold and 200 mana shouldn't be able to take out a 450 gold and 200 mana unit easily as you said an and a matter of fact, a dead can take out an albowtross with blazing bolt....1/3 unit can't hit them. so what? that will make u build ranged unit to counter not all out melee ground units like in stickwar.

Bladed Fire
11-26-2012, 10:40 PM
Well, I think Wingadon don't need to have poison arrows... and their health SHOULD BE DECREASED because they are fast, cheap and deal some damage. Wingadon needs an ability, but this need the Wingadon to be more expensive, just like the Albowtross. Fire needs mana? Okay... I suggest Wingadon should have an ability "Extreme Flap" that make their wings flap more faster and can blow of projectiles like arrows and guts but not stone FOR A WHILE like 4-5 seconds costing health or mana, increasing their flying speed. Deads... immune to pain, so throwing their guts is nothing for them, but guts is limited right? After they throw out all their guts, they attack for melee that deals more damage than their guts but NO POISON. Like 20-30 guts they have in their body.Well, Magikill is an old man, when they cast spell that hit the air and bend their back, why their back didn't break? Magikill is an old man, so speed of casting is slower like speed of walking, plus if you use him correctly, you can have a big advantage to win. About the monk's upgrade, I suggest an ability called "God's Area" or what, that make AOE effect of healing, but smaller than Magikill's blast.

Tecness2
11-27-2012, 05:48 AM
Again....chaos don't need that much poison...already have a lot
ya arguement over albowtross and deads don't make any sense. blazing bolt is a passive upgrade, not a ability...the deads is ability....and it can turn the tide when used right.
crawler CAN handle up to 3 hits from albow tross arrows with blazing bolt not 2 and could be up to 4-5 because the run speed make ranged units misses.
something with the price of 300 gold and 200 mana shouldn't be able to take out a 450 gold and 200 mana unit easily as you said an and a matter of fact, a dead can take out an albowtross with blazing bolt....1/3 unit can't hit them. so what? that will make u build ranged unit to counter not all out melee ground units like in stickwar.
1: They have Two things of poison. Dead's poison guts and Medusa's poison pool. They are the masters of poison, THEY SHOULD HAVE A LOT MORE.
2: I KNOW ONE IS A PASSIVE ABILITY. I'M TRYING TO CHANGE THAT. Why don't people understand that?
3: I have no idea what this is referring too.
4: THE FACT THAT THEY ARE STRONGER THAN THEIR COUNTERPARTS (WINGADON = ARCHIDON) AND THAT THEY ARE IMMUNE TO BEING ATTACKED BY 2/3rds OF THE GAME, MAKES THEM OVERPOWERED.
5: As It should -_-. I will use my example again:
Having strong air units that are good against ground units, is like going into a CoD game, with a perk that makes you immune to explosions and bullets, while your character is a hand-to-hand & weapons combat master.


Well, I think Wingadon don't need to have poison arrows... and their health SHOULD BE DECREASED because they are fast, cheap and deal some damage. Wingadon needs an ability, but this need the Wingadon to be more expensive, just like the Albowtross. Fire needs mana? Okay... I suggest Wingadon should have an ability "Extreme Flap" that make their wings flap more faster and can blow of projectiles like arrows and guts but not stone FOR A WHILE like 4-5 seconds costing health or mana, increasing their flying speed. Deads... immune to pain, so throwing their guts is nothing for them, but guts is limited right? After they throw out all their guts, they attack for melee that deals more damage than their guts but NO POISON. Like 20-30 guts they have in their body.Well, Magikill is an old man, when they cast spell that hit the air and bend their back, why their back didn't break? Magikill is an old man, so speed of casting is slower like speed of walking, plus if you use him correctly, you can have a big advantage to win. About the monk's upgrade, I suggest an ability called "God's Area" or what, that make AOE effect of healing, but smaller than Magikill's blast.
1: They took that out because it was too op (I think). Chaos are the masters of poison and they only have two poison abilities. They need some more :p
2: Deads regenerate their body as they rip it out. THEY BE MAJIK.
3: Would be interesting to see a magikill die from breaking his back....
4: Like place a healing ward? :p

petmuju
11-27-2012, 07:41 AM
Well, Magikill is an old man, when they cast spell that hit the air and bend their back, why their back didn't break? Magikill is an old man, so speed of casting is slower like speed of walking, plus if you use him correctly, you can have a big advantage to win.

Magikills used to be young in stick war! XD
Q: How did your Dead die?
A: Oh, he ripped out too many guts! XD
Q: How did your Magikill die?
A: He broke his back! XD
Q: How your castle archer die?
A: ... He can't di- Oh, he shot an arrow on his leg and tripped over and fell! XD

TheFighterz
11-27-2012, 07:46 PM
Increased Bomber health? Kamakaziee units are intended to be weak and picked off at a distance. Not to simply eat up long range weapons.

Blazing Bolts I can agree with 5, or 20 per arrow w/ cooldown like Archidon, but 15 per is a bit much.

Tecness2
11-27-2012, 08:02 PM
Increased Bomber health? Kamakaziee units are intended to be weak and picked off at a distance. Not to simply eat up long range weapons.

Blazing Bolts I can agree with 5, or 20 per arrow w/ cooldown like Archidon, but 15 per is a bit much.
I suggested blazing bolts to cost 10 per arrow, no cooldown, like the dead. The Dead's poison guts I suggested to be moved up to 15.

Well, I suggested the health upgrade for it to make more sense! This guy ate his vegetables, so he's able to carry more bombs as well as have a bit more hp!

Also, there was a game I played, I can't remember, but as you had more units (Say, 0/80, then 35/80, then 70/80) the cost of units would increase. If the numbers were edited a bit, what do ya'll think about this? :p
It would decrease massing swordwrath/crawlers as much.

petmuju
11-27-2012, 10:00 PM
So, something like miner hustle but for bombers? Carries more bombs for extra damage and more health! XD

My balancing idea would be decreasing the miner hustle health slightly because he has more health than a swordwrath. O_o

And congratz in being a moderator! :D

Bladed Fire
11-27-2012, 10:20 PM
1: They took that out because it was too op (I think). Chaos are the masters of poison and they only have two poison abilities. They need some more :p
2: Deads regenerate their body as they rip it out. THEY BE MAJIK.
3: Would be interesting to see a magikill die from breaking his back....
4: Like place a healing ward? :p

1: I think they should not remove the ability.
2.Majik? Meaning? Guts need to be limited when you think it logically.
3.Well... needs meric to heal him.
4.Why a ward? That abiity is not overpowered anyway...

Bladed Fire
11-27-2012, 10:21 PM
I suggested blazing bolts to cost 10 per arrow, no cooldown, like the dead. The Dead's poison guts I suggested to be moved up to 15.

Well, I suggested the health upgrade for it to make more sense! This guy ate his vegetables, so he's able to carry more bombs as well as have a bit more hp!

Also, there was a game I played, I can't remember, but as you had more units (Say, 0/80, then 35/80, then 70/80) the cost of units would increase. If the numbers were edited a bit, what do ya'll think about this? :p
It would decrease massing swordwrath/crawlers as much.
Blazing bolts no way to cost of mana, fire needs matches... cost of gold approximately 10 to 30 or even 5 is better.
Bomber is suicide... just for bomb only... no way you keep him a long time... and bombers is like prisoners for Chaos, so I think upgrading the bomber's bombs into poison is better or increase damage and range.
I played alot of game that does this... not only one. I think Crazy Jay should add this thing.

Dracus94
11-27-2012, 10:32 PM
Tec, what's with you and your never ending hatred for massing and flying units XD
And I think it would be a bit.. stupid to say the least if almost every chaos unit had a poison ability.

Tecness2
11-28-2012, 05:37 AM
Tec, what's with you and your never ending hatred for massing and flying units XD
And I think it would be a bit.. stupid to say the least if almost every chaos unit had a poison ability.
If you want to mass one type of unit, go play starcraft 2 and mass marines, one of the cheapest things you can do in that game. I like playing games, with some sort of honor. Playing RTS using a diverse set of units and each unit being able to be attacked by each of your enemies units, and vice versa.

300noob
11-30-2012, 12:34 AM
might as well nerf the medusa and marowkai spam + giants....it's one heck of a powerful combination...my giants got drag out and killed while my meric and mage and other units got stoned to death by a line of medusa.

_Ai_
11-30-2012, 12:50 AM
but i like albowtrosses.... but stll can be defeated. hey, a giant(full upgraded) can kill 5 of em while sustaining heavy damage

MiamiBigAL
11-30-2012, 06:30 PM
Tec, you mass juggerknights every time. You can't complain about people massing units and then do it yourself.

Tecness2
11-30-2012, 06:40 PM
Tec, you mass juggerknights every time. You can't complain about people massing units and then do it yourself.
Mass juggers? At any one time, I have between 5-7 juggerknights, 2-3 medusa, 5-8 deads, and sometimes a skeleton mage. I don't mass one type of unit, I keep a diverse army of multiple types, which is why, when it's finished, it's nearly unstoppable.

300noob
12-05-2012, 05:39 AM
Power of quality army over quantities army.
i beat a guy with 2 giants , lots of archer and a mage with some speartons, some archers, some merics, some albowtrosses and a mage and some ninja... after that first face of battle i went for a giant to supressive his giant.nearly killed his 3rd newly spawned giant and won

Triss
12-17-2012, 12:52 AM
I think Albowtross is quite weak. I fight 7 of them with 3 giants, with only casualities of a giant

300noob
12-17-2012, 01:17 AM
I think Albowtross is quite weak. I fight 7 of them with 3 giants, with only casualities of a giant
7 albowtross, pop=28, 3 giant pop= 21
well albowtross is ko after 2 hits from giant....in other words , i agree...
Note: this thread is kinda old

_Ai_
12-18-2012, 03:59 AM
you have to use them with a meatshield