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View Full Version : Spearton Shield Wall: Yes or No?



Tecness2
12-23-2012, 12:35 AM
Okay, so here's the proposal. While in shield wall, enemy units are unable to pass them. If there is, say 5, enemy units could go AROUND them though. If there is 6, no enemies can get past, or around them. Yay or Nay?

Bladed Fire
12-23-2012, 01:30 AM
Okay, so here's the proposal. While in shield wall, enemy units are unable to pass them. If there is, say 5, enemy units could go AROUND them though. If there is 6, no enemies can get past, or around them. Yay or Nay?

I've tested it before... If players manually control their units, NO. If players let them attack the spear tons, meant blocked, so YES.

Tecness2
12-23-2012, 02:05 AM
I've tested it before... If players manually control their units, NO. If players let them attack the spear tons, meant blocked, so YES.
I know English isn't your first language, or at least, isn't your best.
I know what happens currently. This is a suggestion.

Bladed Fire
12-23-2012, 03:11 AM
I know English isn't your first language, or at least, isn't your best.
I know what happens currently. This is a suggestion.

Sorry for that english, and I would like the Speartons to block the opponents, but I think it was too op to have moving walls.

uberman
12-23-2012, 05:49 AM
If they form a wall, will there be any way to break the wall? such as a giant melee strike (only chaos, unless order giants are changed to melee) or a jugger charge? Example a chance of breaching through the wall. Example 50-50 to knockback, stunning the spearton and breach the wall vs 50-50 to stun the charging juggerknight - That would be fun :)
It would also be another reason to build giants though if order giants could breech the wall from range - they are already the best possible use of 7 population and OP as it is - dont get me started.

If this powerfull change is made, what change would be a ballance or off-setting improvement for Chaos? Assuming they are ballanced (and I think fact is either ballance or order is better with things like walls > turrets) then adding to order should be matched by an increase for chaos - other wise the game will be unballanced.

I think its a great idea in principal, a great in character skill for them.
And in 1 vs 1 juggerknight > spearton, so a boost for spear's is in order.

I assume ranged units will be able to fire past the wall, if it is implemented. Projectiles even from ground level can easily pass over a head high wall, think of throwing a ball as a distant object, worst would be a difficulty in line of sight being obscured i.e. a penalty 'to hit' but there is no 'to hit roll', all attacks auto hit in the game mechanic. - or would it only be air units that can fire over a wall?
I assume air units can pass over the wall?

Can air units currently fly over and shoot over miner walls? can archers shoot over miner walls? (not sure if I encountered that yet)
(I know how you feel about air units, but they ARE currently in game and need to be considered)

Currently the miner wall is far better than the turret, if the order potentially have two miner walls and a spear wall, between chaos and their mages/defending units then the chances of chaos actually taking down the defence with a reasonable force is reduced beyond the reasonably challenging to the imossible.

How about giving spears the shield wall as you describe, but taking away the miner wall and giving them the turret, while giving Chaos the miner wall?
(Wait to see the order players shout NO! to that idea - and consider how that shows wall >> turret).
Chaos can build a fixed wall (of wood or dead bodies and bones :) ) costing resources while order can build a wall of spears using units they already own (who still are combat effective with shield attack) at no extra cost AND its mobile - kind of fair?
(Or, maybe, Chaos could be allowed to build moats of poison which poison the units crossing, or acid which damage them for a more chaotic flavour.)

So I havent voted yet, depending on the questions above.

If and only if (iff) chaos gets an offsetting boost, and the wall is implemented well, then YES! it would be great fun.
Iff chaos get naught, order gets a high powered impenetrable mobile defence wall then NO! it would be the end of any pretence that pay to play Chaos is not weaker than free to play Order.

MiamiBigAL
12-23-2012, 09:30 AM
Good in principle. Extremely difficult in practice.

6 Speartons, 10 magikills, here we come...

badplayer
12-23-2012, 11:39 AM
as if its not hard to kill 1 spearton with archers or something...archers outrange magikill spells

as far as i can tell, tecness dislikes air units because it makes his chaos strategy beatable or something along those lines

i think its a good idea, but the upgrade will need to cost more or something because itll actually become viable
i dont think anyone uses shield bash either. why does it even exist? takes 1 second to walk back to the spearton

petmuju
12-24-2012, 02:30 AM
I don't really use spearton wall as they can't fight or move even in this stationary position. I think they should stop enemies from passing through them.

MiamiBigAL
12-24-2012, 05:43 AM
as if its not hard to kill 1 spearton with archers or something...archers outrange magikill spells

as far as i can tell, tecness dislikes air units because it makes his chaos strategy beatable or something along those lines

i think its a good idea, but the upgrade will need to cost more or something because itll actually become viable
i dont think anyone uses shield bash either. why does it even exist? takes 1 second to walk back to the spearton

That is true...until you run out of space to retreat to and he whales on your miners and electric walls your castle entrance.

PsychoticCheez
12-24-2012, 06:19 AM
Making shield wall impassable is, sadly, overpowered.

Alternative options could improve the shield wall/bash, for example:

1. Speartons could be mobile whilst in shield wall mode. Slower, yes, but mobile.
a) Right now, all shield wall is good for is playing musical statues

2. Bigger range for shield bash
a) It may just be me, but I can rarely ever seem to hit with it.

3. Bigger damage reduction
a) Speartons aren't exactly "masters of pain" in their shield wall ability. Why only 40% reduction?

All of the above combined would probably also be overpowered ...although I suppose it would depend on the extent they'd be applied (e.g. 80% reduction vs 55%).

badplayer
12-24-2012, 08:47 AM
maybe u dont know how long it takes to make 10 magikill...the archer masser will definitely have at least 20 which slaughters a spearton in like 2 vollies

Azxc
12-26-2012, 12:03 AM
i support the idea, once your army pass through the middle, you cannot build walls
So... you cannot protect your magic units (magikill and cleric)
You may have 10 speartons trying to protect them....
but your enemy charged at your magic classes, killed them all and run back
So, the conclusion is... meat shield speartons are useless....

So, block enemies in shield mode, I accept higher price on shield wall if this function can be added
Or make an extra upgrade to add this function

_Ai_
12-27-2012, 07:51 AM
I support this idea. because i cant stand the mages sitting there and get killed.

Triss
12-28-2012, 07:56 AM
Actually this should be applied.
How can an unit pass another unit?(like a ghost)