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View Full Version : Help! How do you counter 1 archer+ 1sword start



YJang
04-30-2013, 07:48 PM
How do you guys counter 1 archer+ 1 sword start? Should I just start like that? And I am talking about middle-sized maps. And don't say castle archer please because I want the central tower...

jli
04-30-2013, 08:04 PM
Hmmm, you mean medium sized, not small sized right? In that case, get rage early on and spam swords. Then you can just chase down his archer.

YJang
04-30-2013, 08:34 PM
Yeah thx but the beginning is hard, before raging. How do you beat them without rage at the beginning?

uberman
04-30-2013, 11:18 PM
At the very beginning, you dont beat him - look; he put far more resources into units which built at the same time, you put your resources into economy and one/two swords (even two swords will build in sequence, giving him the early advantage). He should rightly win the very early game due to this - right?

So, you simply dont look to win very early game, you look to survive the first engagements - keep your first sword alive!

Then you must build more swords before you attack him. Your not seriously going to attack a sword and archer with one or even two swords - are you?

You have two options; either defend to keep him off your miners until rage kicks in - which lets him have tower.
Or build 3 or 4 swords and attack to gain tower yourself.

If you have 3 or 4 swords, you have a realistic chance to take down his archer even if he is reasonable at kiting. Just keep a wounded sword behind a stronger one, and if you run away without killing the archer, keep your strongest sword at the back. Retreat to garison any wounded units - this is crucial - if he kills a unit, and you dont kill his, then your getting beaten. If you kill his archer, your winning. If no units die or equal numbers of swords die on both sides, your winning because you have more economy and as long as tower is neutral, your gaining more per second than him.

keep your swords alive, and you'll build up a good number of swords, when rage kicks in you should find the game turns in your favour.
There will be a period when you have rage and he doesnt (due to pumping early military, he probably went for gold not mana for either more miners or swords. So he wont get rage for a while). Use it - don be happy to chase him off the tower only, take out his units and his miners to take him down :)

ShadowGeneralChaos
05-01-2013, 02:07 AM
what about making spearton first? I dont know, but I think it could help.

badplayer
05-01-2013, 08:28 AM
spearton first actually destroys sword+archer, but it's kind of overkill vs anything else (and it probably loses to 4 or even 3 swords? lol)

jli
05-01-2013, 09:05 AM
Never, ever make spearton first. They will mass swords and kill the spearton.
YJang, as for sword + archer start on medium sized maps, do what uberman said. Personally I like to stall until rage kicks in, then dominate.

After that you need to drive HARD. Right before you make a counter for the center, start a miner on praying and get a spearton as soon as you can. His eco is painfully small compared to yours; he needs to catch up. You killed his archer (and maybe some of his swords too), so he needs to prepare a defense (castle archer). That's what that spearton you just got should be used for. Send that spearton in front of your swords to attack his base, remember to keep your swords away from the spearton to avoid the splash damage. He is forced to garrison lest he lose all his miners (which aren't many in number anyway). Now, DO NOT MAKE MORE MINERS. Your eco is already better than his, to push your eco even further ahead is a little overkill gives you an unnecessary surplus. Keep spamming speartons to tank through is castle archer damage. At this point it's pretty easy. Rotate out low health speartons, occasionally use swords to deal extreme damage to anything that might resist your army (such as a stray sword or spear).

It should be pretty straightforward :)

Invincitron
05-01-2013, 09:06 AM
Never, ever make spearton first. They will mass swords and kill the spearton.
YJang, as for sword + archer start on medium sized maps, do what uberman said. Personally I like to stall until rage kicks in, then dominate.

I used to not know how to counter Spearton rush (Not that statue thing, goodness (>.>))....

.:Invincitron:.

YJang
05-01-2013, 04:12 PM
spearton first actually destroys sword+archer, but it's kind of overkill vs anything else (and it probably loses to 4 or even 3 swords? lol)

Thx but I don't think thats good idea because I would have very low economy :)


At the very beginning, you dont beat him - look; he put far more resources into units which built at the same time, you put your resources into economy and one/two swords (even two swords will build in sequence, giving him the early advantage). He should rightly win the very early game due to this - right?

So, you simply dont look to win very early game, you look to survive the first engagements - keep your first sword alive!

Then you must build more swords before you attack him. Your not seriously going to attack a sword and archer with one or even two swords - are you?

You have two options; either defend to keep him off your miners until rage kicks in - which lets him have tower.
Or build 3 or 4 swords and attack to gain tower yourself.

If you have 3 or 4 swords, you have a realistic chance to take down his archer even if he is reasonable at kiting. Just keep a wounded sword behind a stronger one, and if you run away without killing the archer, keep your strongest sword at the back. Retreat to garison any wounded units - this is crucial - if he kills a unit, and you dont kill his, then your getting beaten. If you kill his archer, your winning. If no units die or equal numbers of swords die on both sides, your winning because you have more economy and as long as tower is neutral, your gaining more per second than him.

keep your swords alive, and you'll build up a good number of swords, when rage kicks in you should find the game turns in your favour.
There will be a period when you have rage and he doesnt (due to pumping early military, he probably went for gold not mana for either more miners or swords. So he wont get rage for a while). Use it - don be happy to chase him off the tower only, take out his units and his miners to take him down :)

Wow thx


Never, ever make spearton first. They will mass swords and kill the spearton.
YJang, as for sword + archer start on medium sized maps, do what uberman said. Personally I like to stall until rage kicks in, then dominate.

After that you need to drive HARD. Right before you make a counter for the center, start a miner on praying and get a spearton as soon as you can. His eco is painfully small compared to yours; he needs to catch up. You killed his archer (and maybe some of his swords too), so he needs to prepare a defense (castle archer). That's what that spearton you just got should be used for. Send that spearton in front of your swords to attack his base, remember to keep your swords away from the spearton to avoid the splash damage. He is forced to garrison lest he lose all his miners (which aren't many in number anyway). Now, DO NOT MAKE MORE MINERS. Your eco is already better than his, to push your eco even further ahead is a little overkill gives you an unnecessary surplus. Keep spamming speartons to tank through is castle archer damage. At this point it's pretty easy. Rotate out low health speartons, occasionally use swords to deal extreme damage to anything that might resist your army (such as a stray sword or spear).

It should be pretty straightforward :)

Thanks :D I will give it a try

nullhead
05-18-2013, 07:14 PM
I agree, but there is a lot (and I mean a lot) of advantages your opponents can use with micro, and you should use micro in a majority of all instances. but overall, we take this too lightly, we think that just because we can't win a battle or a confrontation, we need to send more, but in this case, you don't micro enough(i used to not know how), another thing is, don't follow any step by step plan to win, you need to be random, and think of new things, make guerrilla warfare mentally as well as physically.