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Sevarus
04-15-2015, 01:21 PM
I am a very big fan of deads. In fact when I brought chaos the main reason for doing so was because I deads I love the fact they can poison units and that they are so tanky for backline units.
My problem is that now I am in the 1600-2000 skill level I run in to very good opponents who wont charge into a juggerknight+dead v Spearton+ archer battle instead their speartons will just mess with my deads and kill them all off and I end up losing as I cant keep up with the DPS my oppenent has aka the Archers survive but the dead are killed and I lose a jugger knight v spear ton + archer battle

my questions are

1. if I decide to get eclipsors how many miners should I have on mana to mass produce them (I will have 6-8 on gold by this point) I always brought deads as they are the first ranged units available with the hope of scoring a quick wins which does work 50% of the time.

2. What am I doing wrong. their must be a way to protect my deads or kill the enemy units before they kill my deads. After all deads are tanks and theirs time to do something about the attacking units.

3. What are the advantages of using eclipsors they are more expensive so I could get my first dead out quicker than my first eclipsor. But what do I get in return.

4. I have little experience with eclipsors when are they best used and how are how are they best used. Are they used differently to deads to.

5. Are eclipsors more competitive at high level play?

Thank you for my time and with these answers I feel I could be a much better player.

HashBrownTrials
04-15-2015, 04:04 PM
Eclipsors and deads is all personal preference, though sometimes it matters. Just be sure to get charged and kill the spears. Pull your one dead back and keep attacking. If your spears go for your deads then go for his exposed archers. The player will probably panic and not know what to do, be sure to have efficient micro and work and your upgrades and don't forget to Que up units.

spino
04-15-2015, 06:24 PM
I personally prefer eclipsors though deads tend to be more trustworthy unless the opponent cannot produce nearly as quickly as you or has made many ground melee units.

PUMU
04-16-2015, 11:06 PM
With deads just make bombs. Don't rush into swords just keep the distance

Mystery
04-18-2015, 01:39 PM
even though it looks like eclipsors and deads have similar power and just personal choice

but in my experience deads are much more powerful if you can use them efficiently.
For eclipsors, even you have slightly more pop or eco, you may still lose because wings cannot break spear+meric turtle
but deads can stop any order turtle efficiently.

Just like what pumu said, support deads with bombers, then they will be very powerful

Sevarus
04-19-2015, 12:35 PM
So stop queing Jugger knights and get some bombers?

And if one dead is getting beaten up by spears retreat it. and then do the same if they target another dead

how do I go after exposed archers if the archers just retreat deads don't have that option? Would Charge help?

What about eclipsors do I wait a little longer to start produceing them than deads?

Skeletonxf
04-19-2015, 02:30 PM
So stop queing Jugger knights and get some bombers?

And if one dead is getting beaten up by spears retreat it. and then do the same if they target another dead

how do I go after exposed archers if the archers just retreat deads don't have that option? Would Charge help?

What about eclipsors do I wait a little longer to start produceing them than deads?
I'll answer in reverse order

Eclipsors are going to take a stronger mana income so presumably yes, though you won't have to initially commit as much gold to get out your first one versus dead + poison so you can probably go for eclipsors about the same time as you would deads. No matter what you want to be bringing them out once the opponent is massing archers.

If his archers retreat then you've got a dead+jugg versus spearton battle which will be in your favour

Retreat that dead, and move one of your deads forward to attack exposed archers.

Queue Jugger Knights and bombs at the same time, or you'll waste a few seconds by not keeping the melee units permanently queued up and having moments when you're not buying either.

Sevarus
04-19-2015, 02:45 PM
If the archers retreat and i move the attacked dead then do I carry on chasing the archer or bring back my jugger knights to attack the spears. Do if defiantly need charge to chase the archers?

When i move a dead to attack the explodes archer do i move one archer or all of them?

do i need to kill them? or will poison be enough?

nutsophast
04-26-2015, 04:06 AM
I reccomend getting 3 miners on mana when you start getting wings (eclipsors). Deads will actually cost more mana in the long run so you might even need 5-6. If you didn't know, poison guts actually costs mana for deads. Each time you poison a unit you will lose mana, but not if you hit a unit that's already poisoned.

I think the best way to survive with deads is take the game slow and steady. With deads, there is usually no turning back. I recommend starting slow and more defensive, then slowly making your way to tower and then your opponent's base. Support your deads and don't worry about turtles. Try to get a medusa too, they work great with deads. Get the poison puddle upgrade ASAP, this will give your deads a chance to retreat when you need to. Charge will also keep away spears.

The advantages of using wings I would say is that they have a better harassment capability. Another thing is that they are faster then archers or fires, constantly fly over the tanks to get at the archers, make use of your speed. Focus up your eco earlier, that way you can get your first wing fast.

I don't know what you mean with your fifth question.

Sevarus
04-26-2015, 05:31 AM
Thanx nutsophast thats what i was looking for.

So if i am massing deads do I not get tower?
Support your deads? with juugerknights?
How does venom flux allow your deads to retreat? I have a replay i can show you that will show the problem i continually face

nutsophast
04-26-2015, 09:57 PM
Well, you get tower eventually, and like mystery and pumu said, if you support your deads with bombers they will be powerful. Venom flux allows your deads to retreat because archers can't really go over that puddle. Most good players won't have a lot of spears, and if they do it won't work out for them in the long run.

Sevarus
04-27-2015, 12:30 PM
Why won't it work out? Eclipsors?

here is replay

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay9238264&version=2.28

nutsophast
04-27-2015, 07:47 PM
What you should've done is buy deads earlier. Also, if the opponent has that many swords you should use bombers. You also didn't take it easy with the first dead, you kept attacking him. With the first deads you should be a little more defensive. I wouldn't have switched to wings, but in this game it turned out well so I don't know what to say about it.

Spears won't work out very well because juggs + deads will rip them apart, they might kill a few deads but they will lose a lot more money. Archers are cheaper and do the job better.

Sevarus
05-02-2015, 07:55 AM
A 1900 resigned against me!

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay9316026&version=2.28

WheresMyCheetos
05-03-2015, 11:49 AM
I am in the 1600-2000 skill level

That gap man, I don't think you can be 1600 skill some days and 2000 on other days. Lol

Sevarus
05-04-2015, 10:36 AM
Haha trust me I can

This was one of my off days.

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay9316171&version=2.28

Im not if their was a glitch with my mana at the beginning and im sure I clicked thee times on the statue earlier on to get mana.

And I never send my mines into battle lol

PS

should I have used medusa their

Can you use Medusa and Marrowkias together?

MasterKaito
05-04-2015, 04:32 PM
Haha trust me I can

This was one of my off days.

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay9316171&version=2.28

Im not if their was a glitch with my mana at the beginning and im sure I clicked thee times on the statue earlier on to get mana.

And I never send my mines into battle lol

PS

should I have used medusa their

Can you use Medusa and Marrowkias together?

So on monday you can be 1600 on and on Wednesday you can be 1950? and then on friday perhaps 1700s?

Skeletonxf
05-05-2015, 01:17 PM
That gap man, I don't think you can be 1600 skill some days and 2000 on other days. Lol
Some days I feel like I'm 2.1k and other days more like 1.9k.

It happens.

Concentration level dependent usually.

Sevarus
05-05-2015, 06:14 PM
I secound that

#Skele

MasterKaito
05-05-2015, 07:00 PM
Skele, your average is 2Kish tho. 1600-2000 is a big gap.

Sevarus
05-07-2015, 10:36 AM
So trust me I know my own grade

MasterKaito
05-07-2015, 02:57 PM
You didn't explain anything.

WheresMyCheetos
05-08-2015, 08:46 PM
Some days I feel like I'm 2.1k and other days more like 1.9k.

It happens.

Concentration level dependent usually.

Usually people have around 200 gap in rating, anymore and you are like two different people

spino
05-09-2015, 08:25 AM
Can you use Medusa and Marrowkias together?

Yes you are very capable of doing so.

Sevarus
05-09-2015, 09:57 AM
I mean is it a good comination?
is it better than two medusas?
to marrowkia?

you know the bishop pair in chess? is it like that?

PUMU
05-18-2015, 11:25 PM
Its exactly like chess... Well... Aside from no board... Or knights... Or rooks.... Or king and queen... And no specific movement pattern for any unit as an individual... And its play being completely different but yeah I guess its the same.
Starting a thread.