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Thread: Ele assesement

  1. #121
    It just doesn't matter! Phaxtolgia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skeletonxf View Post
    Pumu I didn't say I can't win with fire macros, I was saying it's stupid how half the time you can't land a single hit with them.

    Hash, wouldn't that really hurt late game ele though?
    I suppose not; Chaos wings and Order albows have a 20 second or more quene time.

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  2. #122
    Void Skeletonxf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superterry View Post
    I suppose not; Chaos wings and Order albows have a 20 second or more quene time.
    I was thinking more about ele bringing out charrogs, infernoes and fires.
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  3. #123
    Senior Member Mystery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superterry View Post
    I suppose not; Chaos wings and Order albows have a 20 second or more quene time.
    fires cannot compare with wings and albows at all

    Using fires and air in late game for ele is quite a suicide.

    Yesterday I tried to use new builds against other players in ranked
    then my rating dropped from 2612 to 2500

    So I realized more problems for elemental,especially EvC

    For EvC, in the chaos side, you only need three units, Wings, bombers and medusa, once you get them set up, it is an auto-win for EvC

    Originally I tried to invent a new elemental build to counter chaos, because cycloid does not work well on countering wings, so I tried to use a V build.
    My plan is to, grab a 3minute early V, then I possess the first wing of the chaos player, and eliminate his wing one by one without letting him to get more

    But later I figure out this build does not work well at all. Because the chaos players can simply rush 6-7 bombers to kill that single V , or use crawler upgrade to eliminate V.
    I played champ344 's chaos in ranked. When I used order, I won 10-1. But when I used elemental, I lost 3-0 without able to win even once.
    And he is only 2.1k-2.2k classic player, while I am 2.6k elemental player, which shows the great flaws of elemental.

    For EvO , I can win easily with trees. But without trees, most other builds do not work at all. Yesterday I used a early V against a 2k order player, and I lost quite ridiculously. Because it is just too expensive and not efficient.
    One V = 1300 gold +100mana, but one V cannot deal with three archers and two swords (1150 gold) .
    For the other way round, I also played a good ET player called ordwiz, who is a good turtler. I used elemental to play him in ice world, but ended up I spent 16 minutes to have game with him and I lost, once his turtle is set up , I have no method to break it. His turtle set up (4 ninjas, 3 magkills, 3 merics, and 1 giant) .

    So from what I see the talk about increasing queue time, nerf elemental units, do not really make sense.
    Especially when elemental is the empire with the weakest ranged unit, nerfing the weakest part of elemental just makes it more unbalanced.
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  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by mysterybat View Post
    fires cannot compare with wings and albows at all

    Using fires and air in late game for ele is quite a suicide.

    Yesterday I tried to use new builds against other players in ranked
    then my rating dropped from 2612 to 2500

    So I realized more problems for elemental,especially EvC

    For EvC, in the chaos side, you only need three units, Wings, bombers and medusa, once you get them set up, it is an auto-win for EvC

    Originally I tried to invent a new elemental build to counter chaos, because cycloid does not work well on countering wings, so I tried to use a V build.
    My plan is to, grab a 3minute early V, then I possess the first wing of the chaos player, and eliminate his wing one by one without letting him to get more

    But later I figure out this build does not work well at all. Because the chaos players can simply rush 6-7 bombers to kill that single V , or use crawler upgrade to eliminate V.
    I played champ344 's chaos in ranked. When I used order, I won 10-1. But when I used elemental, I lost 3-0 without able to win even once.
    And he is only 2.1k-2.2k classic player, while I am 2.6k elemental player, which shows the great flaws of elemental.

    For EvO , I can win easily with trees. But without trees, most other builds do not work at all. Yesterday I used a early V against a 2k order player, and I lost quite ridiculously. Because it is just too expensive and not efficient.
    One V = 1300 gold +100mana, but one V cannot deal with three archers and two swords (1150 gold) .
    For the other way round, I also played a good ET player called ordwiz, who is a good turtler. I used elemental to play him in ice world, but ended up I spent 16 minutes to have game with him and I lost, once his turtle is set up , I have no method to break it. His turtle set up (4 ninjas, 3 magkills, 3 merics, and 1 giant) .

    So from what I see the talk about increasing queue time, nerf elemental units, do not really make sense.
    Especially when elemental is the empire with the weakest ranged unit, nerfing the weakest part of elemental just makes it more unbalanced.

    I agree with most of what you say.

    Here are best suggestions:

    • Give Cycloid Tornado at start and add level 2 research-> increases damage+/radius+/speed | (collective agree on Cycloid thread)
    • Make Meteor Shower *coals* burn structures-> (walls, turrets) when coals are underneath | (my idea)
    • Armour upgrade for Charrog-> They currently have unbalanced hp to deal with wings+albows in late game | (Skeletonxf's idea)
    Last edited by PineappleReturnz; 03-19-2015 at 10:18 AM. Reason: grammar

  5. #125
    A Stick Empires Player AsePlayer's Avatar
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    Solve the Castle Air Issues.

    Make it into a Castle Fire that does some splash along with minimal burn.
    Quote Originally Posted by sss
    You are the cancer of stickpage you fucking fuckity fuck fuck
    Quote Originally Posted by HashBrownTrials View Post
    By the time the new update comes out DAZ would've gone through puberty. Lel
    Quote Originally Posted by WyzDM View Post
    Also Fuck EvE. That's not a matchup. That's a rock-paper-I-don't-give-a-fuck.

  6. #126
    Void Skeletonxf's Avatar
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    Gosh, we've actually come to some sort of general agreement for once on a few things.
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  7. #127
    A Stick Empires Player AsePlayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AsePlayer View Post
    Solve the Castle Air Issues.

    Make it into a Castle Fire that does some splash along with minimal burn.
    This way, we solve the whole storming in with a bunch of swords issues, etc.
    Quote Originally Posted by sss
    You are the cancer of stickpage you fucking fuckity fuck fuck
    Quote Originally Posted by HashBrownTrials View Post
    By the time the new update comes out DAZ would've gone through puberty. Lel
    Quote Originally Posted by WyzDM View Post
    Also Fuck EvE. That's not a matchup. That's a rock-paper-I-don't-give-a-fuck.

  8. #128
    Dopesauce WyzDM's Avatar
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    Castle is is fine. Not having any defensive resources (ie miner wall, miner turret) hurts a lot, and having everything so damn expensive for gold really makes it difficult to grab valuable units.I thing the combinations are fine, it's just the matter of making them.


    Quote Originally Posted by PineappleReturnz View Post
    • Give Cycloid Tornado at start and add level 2 research-> increases damage+/radius+/speed [/B][/I]
    Wat. Like tornadoes aren't good enough against archidons and other ground forces lol. They're just hard to control. They shouldn't be an angled, a straight shot to the same place in front would work immensely. Having it free bird makes controlling and angling it too hard.

    Quote Originally Posted by PineappleReturnz View Post
    • Make Meteor Shower *coals* burn structures-> (walls, turrets) when coals are underneath | (my idea)
    Look, walls aren't the problem, the problem is having units strong or resourceful enough to pressure and break through. Look at how chaos handles the order wall. I personally think with the way units are now, it's fine, the issue again just goes to how hard it is to get the number of jugs or infernos or other spellcasters to use viably.


    Quote Originally Posted by PineappleReturnz View Post
    • Armour upgrade for Charrog-> They currently have unbalanced hp to deal with wings+albows in late game | (Skeletonxf's idea)
    Skele did you really freakin suggest this? Are you implying charrogs aren't tanky enough? F@#$%ing hell They have almost 2x the health as the spearton! Quick! Buff spears! Albowtross 2stronk?!



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  9. #129
    A Stick Empires Player AsePlayer's Avatar
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    Lmao WyzDM obviously ele has the all powerful blind gate
    Quote Originally Posted by sss
    You are the cancer of stickpage you fucking fuckity fuck fuck
    Quote Originally Posted by HashBrownTrials View Post
    By the time the new update comes out DAZ would've gone through puberty. Lel
    Quote Originally Posted by WyzDM View Post
    Also Fuck EvE. That's not a matchup. That's a rock-paper-I-don't-give-a-fuck.

  10. #130
    Void Skeletonxf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WyzDM View Post
    Skele did you really freakin suggest this? Are you implying charrogs aren't tanky enough? F@#$%ing hell They have almost 2x the health as the spearton! Quick! Buff spears! Albowtross 2stronk?!
    My suggestion has been simplified a little from how I posted it. I suggested significantly less health pre upgrade, current hp levels on upgrade and a slight hp buff after that on second upgrade, not increasing their hp by much more than another bar or two. Perhaps if the other ele unit gold costs are sorted out then charrogs won't cut out so much of the net gold supply and actually their current hp could be the second upgrade of health.

    The main focus of my suggestion was that charrogs are too tanky early game.
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