Herbivore, I celebrate Christmas because its basically no longer a church holiday, but a country-wide and statewide holiday. Christmas is now a commercial haven and people celebrate it because it is, in effect, a second birthday.

Herbivore, you have FAILED in every one of your arguments. You are too much of an idiot to understand even the simplest of logical connections, and have stepped around every argument you couldn't directly combat.

Leave the debate section. You are embarrassing yourself. I'm not even going to justify your pitiful arguments with responses, because they will only lead to more attempts at stepping around my points.

It is interesting to think that you may honestly believe that you are making any sense. What I've seen is that you know your way around the English language well enough to structure a coherent sentence, and yet are unable to express or understand meaning within writing. This became evident when you attempted to argue that I am indeed a believer in god just because I behaved like a Christian, failing to take into account simple variables like tradition, habit, and secrecy.

You are an imbecile, and you don't even realize it. This is the first time I've ever made a personal attack instead of debating the topic at hand in a long history of debating. I'm just dumbfounded that you would be so oblivious to simple observations that even the lowest of intellects can make.


I have come to this conclusion.

Either this is a troll, and should be reported as such, or this is just a really deluded individual.

Frankly, I suspect a troll, and so I am reporting him.

Hell, I'd report him even if he isn't a troll.

Well, I did.

Hopefully we'll be able to get some competent/non-troll debaters in here.

I would step up, but it sounds like a job, and I don't like working for stuff I don't get paid for.


Unless its being a pornstar, then hell ... It'd totally be worth it.

I don't think people need a god. What we need, however, is answers. If there is something we don't understand, we usually want to figure it out, it's the way most of us work. To me, religion is basically either one or both of two things: One of them is an easy answer. We don't get something, so we simply say it is beyond our comprehension, and leave it at that. As we figure more and more shit out, the need for 'the easy answer' diminishes. We no longer have to say something is beyond our comprehension, and therefore divine, because it is no longer beyond our comprehension. The other thing religion is is a way to cope with death. I would assume that most people get scared when they realize they might be nothing next week, and therefore resort to faith in something beyond our world. To me, the first one is the bad one. If we simply accept that we cannot understand something, and therefore stop trying, we will never progress. We don't need that type of thinking, in fact we should refrain from it. (A third thing it could be is a way to control people, but that is irrelevant in this context.)

As people, as a race, we do not need religion. We are perfectly capable of helping old women across the street without an overhanging threat of damnation. If we are taught to do good, we will generally do good. And even if we're not, we'd still generally be nice, because we have this awesome thing called empathy.

For some individuals, however, belief is absolutely a necessity. It doesn't matter that it's a necessity they wouldn't have if religion never existed in the first place, simply because it did exist in the first place, and thus they need it. They need to believe that there is something great and benevolent, and that everything will work out in the end. As individuals, we need whatever, be it chocolate, religion, music or basketball. As a race, we need shelter, food, water, sex, etc.

Quote from alive

I don't think people need a god. What we need, however, is answers.

And I agree. We are a naturally curious species.

If there is something we don't understand, we usually want to figure it out, it's the way most of us work. To me, religion is basically either one or both of two things: One of them is an easy answer.

I don't understand this. People have this idea that religion, the idea of a god, is an easy answer.

This can't be further from the truth. Any critical thought applied to the ideas of a god immediately creates even MORE questions, ones about which hundreds of books have been written, and yet if a child asks his pastor "Who made God" the pastor's response, be it "He always was" or be it "He made himself", more questions arise about not only the integrity of the applied logic, but also to the idea of God itself.

If the idea of God was an easy one, I think we would have made at least a LITTLE progress with it.

We don't get something, so we simply say it is beyond our comprehension, and leave it at that. As we figure more and more shit out, the need for 'the easy answer' diminishes. We no longer have to say something is beyond our comprehension, and therefore divine, because it is no longer beyond our comprehension.

The other thing religion is is a way to cope with death. I would assume that most people get scared when they realize they might be nothing next week, and therefore resort to faith in something beyond our world. To me, the first one is the bad one. If we simply accept that we cannot understand something, and therefore stop trying, we will never progress. We don't need that type of thinking, in fact we should refrain from it. (A third thing it could be is a way to control people, but that is irrelevant in this context.)

As people, as a race, we do not need religion. We are perfectly capable of helping old women across the street without an overhanging threat of damnation. If we are taught to do good, we will generally do good. And even if we're not, we'd still generally be nice, because we have this awesome thing called empathy.

For some individuals, however, belief is absolutely a necessity. It doesn't matter that it's a necessity they wouldn't have if religion never existed in the first place, simply because it did exist in the first place, and thus they need it. They need to believe that there is something great and benevolent, and that everything will work out in the end. As individuals, we need whatever, be it chocolate, religion, music or basketball. As a race, we need shelter, food, water, sex, etc.

I will agree that religion might help a few people. However, I feel that it does far more harm in general than good.



I'll use Christianity as my example, since I know it best.

I think everyone will agree that the Old Testament is filled with inaccuracies.
"But wait, we don't believe in a LITERAL interpretation of Genesis, it's more of a poem about Creation."

Okay, you may think that, and I won't deny that you do. But not everyone has the same view. Some people think that it SHOULD be taken literally, and why shouldn't they? After all, it tells them it's the inspired word of God. Just as well, imagine a priest explaining to his congregation that Genesis is just a "poem about creation."

One might "know" that it's not meant to be taken literally, but someone else will also "know" that it IS meant to be taken literally.

This is all relevant to the discussion because people are supposed to get their morals from the Bible, but by what criteria does one pick and choose those morals?


BTW, this isn't directed at you, Alive, these are just questions that your post gave rise to.

We need Jesus he is are savior whether you like it or not. How the hell else did the universe become what it is now? Stick with God and he will stick with you.

Ash you seem pretty wise are you old or somthin?

Quote from GameGeek21

We need Jesus he is are savior whether you like it or not. How the hell else did the universe become what it is now? Stick with God and he will stick with you.

Ash you seem pretty wise are you old or somthin?

I completely agree man.

I vomited in rage just now.

I don't think we need a God, in answer to the title. However, As a previous Christian, now Agnostic I can share what I know. I know that when I was strictly Chrsitian, I believed every little scrap of what I was told. Then I read the bible.

Yep. Is it me or the newbies actually venturing into the Debate section now?

There is one thing that I really don't like about the atheist idea that humanity is good enough, when you only need to look at Gaza.

You only need to look at the earth. Then again, if God does exist, why doesn't he step in?

Quote from Steyene

Yep. Is it me or the newbies actually venturing into the Debate section now?

There is one thing that I really don't like about the atheist idea that humanity is good enough, when you only need to look at Gaza.

That's unfair, you cant just take the worst view of us and say that is the best representation.

Quote from Fluxinator

You only need to look at the earth. Then again, if God does exist, why doesn't he step in?

If you have an experiment and it's going to plan, say, you want to create some form of life and see how long it lasts so you know where you've gone wrong to then make the next batch better.. Would you step in?

I, personally, don't believe in him. But the whole "IF HE IS REAL, WHERE IS HE NOW?" shit annoys me.

EDIT: Okay, I've only read some of the first post and the title, I figured this thread would have many good points then there would be idiotic points like something I'm going to say now. Hopefully not.
This may have already been stated.
Anyway, I don't believe in god, I never have. Not that I can remember anyway. My parents don't, they're fully open to religioins but they don't have one of their own. They've coped.
However, if I was brought up to be a strong believer I would probably find it hard to accept him not being real (Not saying he isn't). Some people stop addictions due to God, what they see him as. Some people believe they were cured by a miracle of god. Many could not live without this faith, without meaning. Without reason.
They've been lead into that life and they've told theirself "Without this man/woman there is no reason."

People need god, yes. Not ALL people, but people naturally need something to believe in and need a reason. Many have this reason.
We all have a reason and that reason is our god.