This isn't to argue which religion (If any) is correct, but whether the world would be a better place without religion.

I belive that most acts are terrorism are commited for religious reasons (IE Muslim Extremists), but I'm not going to say that every case of terrorism has been for religious reasons, but I belive the a large amount were. The war in Iraq and Afganistan and other middle eastern countries is a "War on terrorism", And I think without religion that war would not be taking place today in a world that is supposedly sophistocated; And if there was no war the worlds more powerful countries could focus on real problems, like poverty, disease and domestic abuse. So, I belive the world would be a better place if religion never existed.

We are war animals, in my opinion, we would still fight over something.
The world would probably be more focused on science and more discoveries would have be made.
I think that we would be advanced but a bit heartless. We would be a depressive society. Even tough I'm a theist I do believe that religion brings some good things.

The only reason religion causes war is because many concepts open to interpretation, and people will bend and warp their interpretation based on their own beliefs and then spread that interpretation to others. Then they will say, if you do not believe like I do GOD will smite you! I'd say religion started out with good intentions (to be a moral code of conduct) but some just use it as a tool to control other weak minded people.

what about the peaceful religion, guys!!!

Quote from 2-D

what about the peaceful religion, guys!!!

Do you mean Satanism?

mainly Buddhist shit.

But aren't those buddhist monks the guys who slash people in half with their bare hands?

No, they're not.

Would the world be better? Depends on the method. If everyone in the world came to a sudden realization that there are no gods, then chaos would ensue. Not because the belief in a god holds people to a moral standard, but because so many people THINK that it does. When a person thinks that the only thing that prevents them from killing, raping, stealing, etc. is no longer there, then they don't stop to think "well, are there any other reasons not to do this stuff?" No, they don't, they just do those things.

If the method was a steady decline of religion as a result of improving people's critical thinking skills, then yes, the world would be a better place. I submit that the vast majority, if not ALL, of the population of suicide bombers consists of people who have faith that they will be rewarded in the afterlife. You can't get from "I don't believe in God" to "I'm going to perform this action". There is no logical link there that could be made.

Not only that, but teaching better critical thinking skills would eliminate all supernatural beliefs. No more ESP, no more Loch Ness Monster, no more ghosts, no more magic furniture rearrangers, etc.


Would the world be better off without religion? Yes.

Everyone is assuming that if religion disappears, all morals and humanity goes with it. But the thing is that morals existed before religion did, and removing religion would do nothing to it. Animals of other SPECIES have been shown to exhibit compassion and fairness, and I doubt that they do it out of hope for being rewarded in the afterlife.

While religion has brought the world culture and a rich storytelling ability, the fact is that it's now weighing us down. The good that the removal of outdated mistreatment of women and other minorities would do far outweighs the loss of culture that goes with it.

Better? Sure. By how much? Dunno.

Miniman, by sheer dumb luck, has unwittingly brought up an important point. I have no doubt that religion is a problem. How much of problem it is, though, and how much we should be focusing on it, those are more difficult questions. Religion is certainly an interesting subject, and one that has effected my life a great deal, that's why I spend so much time discussing it, but is getting rid of it going to be a magic cure-all solution to the world's problems? Probably not.

Personally, I don't think it would make much of a difference. We would find something else to fight about - poverty, technology, freedom (in some countries).

Ash, how have you come to the conclusion that morals that are present today due to religion? Sure some animals exhibit a certain degree of "fairness" and what not, but then again a lot of animals also exhibit as shit load of pointless violence. See dolphins.

Could you say with certainty that if religion was completely removed that slowly humans wouldn't become more cold hearted and callous, and remove those who a select few deem too genetically weak to pass on their traits?

As for you suicide bombers, many of them are fairly young, i.e. in their teens when they are extremely susceptible to outside influences. They are brainwashed. Not by religion, as that is impossible. Religion can have no effect what so ever on a persons mental state, except perhaps happiness. They are effected by those who wish to wield religion to their own means and gains. Religion I will admit is a very useful tool to gain what one wants, you only need to look at the "Crusades" and the modern Jihad. You are blaming the gun for shooting someone.

As for you saying that someone with no belief wont commit a crime on their ideology, pah. While they mightn't do it for a benefit for their ideology, they still will do it for the better of understanding of humanity. Again someone might kill another person because the other person believes in a deity and person one thinks that person two is far too stupid to be allowed to pass on their beliefs on to others.

Edit: As you probably can guess, I seriously doubt that the world would be better without religion. It is here to provide a balance.

Quote from Steyene

Ash, how have you come to the conclusion that morals that are present today due to religion? Sure some animals exhibit a certain degree of "fairness" and what not, but then again a lot of animals also exhibit as shit load of pointless violence. See dolphins.

Tell me this: if you came to the conclusion that god does not exist, would you go around murdering and raping people?

Could you say with certainty that if religion was completely removed that slowly humans wouldn't become more cold hearted and callous, and remove those who a select few deem too genetically weak to pass on their traits?

Can I say with certainty? No, but that's because absolute certainty is not a part of my philosophical vocabulary.

With near-certainty? Yes, I can, but I'm going to wait for you to answer the above question before I demonstrate this.

As for you suicide bombers, many of them are fairly young, i.e. in their teens when they are extremely susceptible to outside influences. They are brainwashed. Not by religion, as that is impossible. Religion can have no effect what so ever on a persons mental state, except perhaps happiness. They are effected by those who wish to wield religion to their own means and gains. Religion I will admit is a very useful tool to gain what one wants, you only need to look at the "Crusades" and the modern Jihad. You are blaming the gun for shooting someone.

The middle-eastern suicide bombers are brainwashed with a supernatural claim, Steyner. How could one brainwash them without invoking the supernatural? They live a sexless existence, and as teenagers are very sexually frustrated. They are then told that they will be given 72 dark-eyed virgins in the afterlife by their lying leaders if they kill themselves in jihad. As desperate as they are, they don't hesitate. I'd be interested to hear you name one secular way to do this, secular from any claim of the supernatural.

As for you saying that someone with no belief wont commit a crime on their ideology, pah. While they mightn't do it for a benefit for their ideology, they still will do it for the better of understanding of humanity. Again someone might kill another person because the other person believes in a deity and person one thinks that person two is far too stupid to be allowed to pass on their beliefs on to others.

That's not a result of the absence of a belief in a god, Steyner, that's a result of the belief that people who believe in a god are too stupid to be deserving of life. Try again.