Stick Page Forums Archive

Google Translate Sucks

Started by: Salt | Replies: 33 | Views: 3,932

Salt
2

Posts: 5,455
Joined: Jun 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 5:50 AM #1402703
When people are able to properly communicate with each other, they are able to understand each other better. Humans have a tendency to feel that they are the center of everything. There's even a special word when you realize other people have as much of a life as yours, called sonder. The more this feeling is there, the more empathetic and understanding people are of each other. When people are more empathetic they are better at working together, and eventually improving life for everyone. I find it appalling that in the midst of all our technological advancement, it is still extremely difficult to be able to communicate with a person that speaks another language unless you dedicate a significant amount of time to learning their language, and even then you will never really reach a level at which you will be able to have really meaningful conversations unless you use the language frequently. I'm no programmer and I don't know how any of these translation services work, but it seems like a lot more work should be dedicated to improving them.

This whole thing came to mind when a Chinese person joined Hyuns Dojo. She wasn't able to speak proper English at all and no one their could speak Chinese (until lf2 showed up). Google translate would give some extremely butchered results, and for some reason she felt offended when told her she should speak English. Who knows? Maybe the translation of an otherwise neutral statement sounded passive aggressive when translated literally to Chinese? Translation blunders could have significant effects larger than just some random girl on the Internet getting offended:

http://www.lackuna.com/2012/04/13/5-historically-legendary-translation-blunders/
Some of these could be a bit of a stretch, but it's not difficult to imagine a scenario were miscommunication due to language barriers could lead to serious problems.
Drone
2

Posts: 11,650
Joined: Mar 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 6:31 AM #1402717
If you go to a primarily english speaking site owned and managed by english speaking people you should speak english lol.

Also it's impossible to code a translator that works properly just because of the nature of language. One phrase can mean any number of different things and it's unreasonable to ask a coded translator to infer, that's just not how that works. Also gramatical conventions and sentence structures differ greatly between languages, especially between germanic and Asian languages, and that's also something that's nearly impossible to code into a translator.

By the way, this isn't english class fam, you didn't have to preface your point with a life lesson
Cronos

Posts: 5,440
Joined: Apr 2009
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 6:35 AM #1402718
Quote from Drone
If you go to a primarily english speaking site owned and managed by english speaking people you should speak english lol.

Also it's impossible to code a translator that works properly just because of the nature of language. One phrase can mean any number of different things and it's unreasonable to ask a coded translator to infer, that's just not how that works. Also gramatical conventions and sentence structures differ greatly between languages, especially between germanic and Asian languages, and that's also something that's nearly impossible to code into a translator.


No it isn't impossible.

It's just extremely difficult. We have AI programmers working on learning algorithms which will eventually solve this problem. Give it 20 years or so and I guarantee eventually we will have flawless translation.
Salt
2

Posts: 5,455
Joined: Jun 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 7:23 AM #1402734
Quote from Drone
If you go to a primarily english speaking site owned and managed by english speaking people you should speak english lol.

Also it's impossible to code a translator that works properly just because of the nature of language. One phrase can mean any number of different things and it's unreasonable to ask a coded translator to infer, that's just not how that works. Also gramatical conventions and sentence structures differ greatly between languages, especially between germanic and Asian languages, and that's also something that's nearly impossible to code into a translator.

By the way, this isn't english class fam, you didn't have to preface your point with a life lesson


Lol I thought it would have a better impact.

And yes on an English forum you have to use English. That's the point, people still having to learn and use a specific language to perform communication, which isn't convenient or easy.
Quote from Cronos
No it isn't impossible.

It's just extremely difficult. We have AI programmers working on learning algorithms which will eventually solve this problem. Give it 20 years or so and I guarantee eventually we will have flawless translation.

I really hope so. I haven't seen much progress in the matter though. I feel like there needs to bigger interest towards this than their already is, seeing as to how significant it is.
Charry
2

Posts: 2,260
Joined: Jul 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 1:26 PM #1402761
If you really want to speak to a person in another language, maybe you should fucking learn it yourself, not making the internet do it for you. Using translators on the internet (no matter how good they may ever get) is only going to get you so far, which will always be a really broken version of the language, no matter which one.
Salt
2

Posts: 5,455
Joined: Jun 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 1:30 PM #1402762
Quote from Charry
If you really want to speak to a person in another language, maybe you should fucking learn it yourself, not making the internet do it for you. Using translators on the internet (no matter how good they may ever get) is only going to get you so far.

Yeah because learning an entirely different language is easy. Not to mention that everyone has the resources, time, and ability to do so. I'm learning a third language myself, and it's not easy at all, but even with three languages there remains a large number of people I will never be able to properly communicate with, and you never know what you could learn from different people.
Charry
2

Posts: 2,260
Joined: Jul 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 1:39 PM #1402764
I'm not saying it's easy. But for whatever reason you have to learn another language, you should make the effort and put time in to learn it. And as someone who does speak a second language yourself, do you find it more practical to directly speak to another person in a language that you made the effort to learn, or huddled over a keyboard then selecting English?
Salt
2

Posts: 5,455
Joined: Jun 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 1:46 PM #1402766
Quote from Charry
I'm not saying it's easy. But for whatever reason you have to learn another language, you should make the effort and put time in to learn it. And as someone who does speak a second language yourself, do you find it more practical to directly speak to another person in a language that you made the effort to learn, or huddled over a keyboard then selecting English?

It's only practical when you've reached a high level at the language you're trying to speak. Otherwise the entire conversation is mostly both sides faltering and failing at getting the point properly across. It's a lot more practical when you have a proper translator.
Charry
2

Posts: 2,260
Joined: Jul 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 1:54 PM #1402768
It might be at some point in the future, but we aren't there yet, sadly. Especially since language is such a wide, changing part of human nature that technology just can't fully capture. It's easier for us to grasp the entirety of language between other people, because human life is all about learning, and the constant change in language (since most people who've mastered another language have done it faster than technology has). But hey, maybe one day Google will make a really impressive translator, but until then, it just makes more sense to learn Spanish if you're going to Spain for some important meeting (or just hire one of those translator folks).
Salt
2

Posts: 5,455
Joined: Jun 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 2:26 PM #1402774
Quote from Charry
It might be at some point in the future, but we aren't there yet, sadly. Especially since language is such a wide, changing part of human nature that technology just can't fully capture. It's easier for us to grasp the entirety of language between other people, because human life is all about learning, and the constant change in language (since most people who've mastered another language have done it faster than technology has). But hey, maybe one day Google will make a really impressive translator, but until then, it just makes more sense to learn Spanish if you're going to Spain for some important meeting (or just hire one of those translator folks).


I agree. The entire point of this thread wasn't against learning languages, but rather to bring notice to the significance of language barriers even with modern day translation algorithms and technology, which I feel isn't fully appreciated in general.
Cronos

Posts: 5,440
Joined: Apr 2009
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 3:19 PM #1402776
It is not practical to dedicate several years of your life (thousands of hours), to learning a language that you only need to use once or twice, situationaly. And you're wrong Charry, translation software will eventually produce perfect translations. Eventually we will have extremely effective real time speech translation. There will be a time in the future (most likely in your lifetime) where you can easily converse with anyone, regardless of what language you speak. Mark my words.
Apex-Predator
2

Posts: 4,296
Joined: Mar 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 3:29 PM #1402777
Actually it is practical, your career could take you anywhere in the world. If you want to the more independent it would be advantageous to learn other languages.
Carrying a translator around can only get you so far. Mandarin is definitely one of those languages than go on tone and if you've never heard or used a word before the tone in which speak it in could get you in an unwanted situation, it's also good to expand your knowledge.
Salt
2

Posts: 5,455
Joined: Jun 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 9, 2015 5:06 PM #1402784
Quote from Cronos
It is not practical to dedicate several years of your life (thousands of hours), to learning a language that you only need to use once or twice, situationaly. And you're wrong Charry, translation software will eventually produce perfect translations. Eventually we will have extremely effective real time speech translation. There will be a time in the future (most likely in your lifetime) where you can easily converse with anyone, regardless of what language you speak. Mark my words.

And what a time it will be.
Quote from Apex-Predator
Actually it is practical, your career could take you anywhere in the world. If you want to the more independent it would be advantageous to learn other languages.
Carrying a translator around can only get you so far. Mandarin is definitely one of those languages than go on tone and if you've never heard or used a word before the tone in which speak it in could get you in an unwanted situation, it's also good to expand your knowledge.

Practical once mastered. The actual process of learning is in no way easy.
Cronos

Posts: 5,440
Joined: Apr 2009
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 10, 2015 3:10 AM #1402878
And as I said "a language that you will use once or twice, situationally". It is in no way practical or realistic to ask someone to spend thousands of hours learning a language that they only need to use briefly. That's not to say you shouldn't learn languages. Of course you should. But it should be something that has practical use to you. People learn Spanish because it's widely used and they're often interacting with Spanish speakers. People learn Chinese for business reasons, and also for interacting (in Australia there's millions of Chinese speakers). People learn Japanese because it has practical use for almost all people that play video games, or watch anime, or do business/interact with the country (As Australia does in the asia-pacific).
Exile
Administrator
2

Posts: 8,404
Joined: Dec 2005
Rep: 10

View Profile
Sep 10, 2015 1:31 PM #1402965
how do you think widespread, accurate, real-time translation will change the world? any ideas?
Website Version: 1.0.4
© 2025 Max Games. All rights reserved.