Quote from Exilement

Just throwing this out there -- psychopathy is just a detachment from empathy, not a compulsion to do "evil" things. Being a killer doesn't make you a psychopath and being a psychopath doesn't make you a killer.

I suppose I should have refined that to "a murderous psychopath" then.

I guess I'll have to agree with automaton. Humanity is not, contrary to popular belief, one person, and cannot be described as such. Humanity consists of 6.7 billion different people and their history, and applying an imaginary concept such as evil to them like they are one person is wrong.
Just like people who talk about "the state" or "the corporation" as if they are living, breathing entities in themselves are misunderstanding something, I believe you are misunderstanding something if you try to give humanity any defining trait that isn't based on the natural sciences.

I don't believe in good or evil. I believe in relative right and wrong, but for the most part evil is a term I reserve for especially heinous acts. Humanity cannot be evil. We are an animal species like any other with the unique ability to influence more environmentally and ecologically than any other, but we're still animals. Causing the extinction of so many species and converting the matter of million-year-old plants and animals into playthings and fuel is not evil. It's irresponsible of us now that we understand the consequences, but we're not under the magnifying glass of any heavenly magistrate. We probably should stop destroying shit for our own benefit as well as for those organisms we carelessly overlook, but even if we don't, it's only our nature to do so. We are a destructive species. We make tools, communicate, contemplate, and cooperate in order to seek every opportunity we find to make our lives better. Forget posterity and less-fortunate creatures, humanity wants to survive comfortably no matter the cost. And yes, that generalization can be seen to be true worldwide and across all ages up to 150,000 years ago and even further. We are Earth's mold.

Quote from alive

I guess I'll have to agree with automaton. Humanity is not, contrary to popular belief, one person, and cannot be described as such. Humanity consists of 6.7 billion different people and their history, and applying an imaginary concept such as evil to them like they are one person is wrong.
Just like people who talk about "the state" or "the corporation" as if they are living, breathing entities in themselves are misunderstanding something, I believe you are misunderstanding something if you try to give humanity any defining trait that isn't based on the natural sciences.

Indeed, but such traits are not limited to the basics of eyes and ears, etc. Intelligence is a trait inherent in the human race as a whole. So is desire, or greed. This greed is what the quote in the OP was talking about. All people desire something; to some extent this is what keeps us alive, as we desire food when we are hungry and desire sex for the continuation of the species. When this desire is combined with intelligence, however, it creates what some people would consider evil.

A feral human is a dangerous and scary creature to behold. I imagine loners in prehistoric times could be very evil in the normal sense of the word. Humans are a social species, but when placed in environments with no social ties or communication with other humans, we rely on our base instincts, which nature has chosen to leave at pretty much nothing. So humanity can be seen as evil in the sense that left alone, we have no real sense of purpose or goal to achieve, aside from survival and sex. Given our superior ability to fuck shit up, I would say that anyone stripped of the need to fit into a social structure would be hard-pressed not to do something we consider evil if given the chance.

I think the "evil" in cause, is actually "instinct". Basically, the human race is an animal race that has managed to create restraints for itself and to distinguish wrong from right. That started happening significantly ever since the first communities (eg. Ancient Greece). Humans are not overall evil, but overall natural and "wild" animals. Jutsu's thread supports this. People want to do a certain impulsive things, but in reality they would be restrained and stopped by society's regulations, which the SAME human race created FOR THEMSELVES.

I don't think we are evil for ruining the environment. In this case we've just been unaware of the results of our actions throughout time. Some of us have not been given the proper education and taught the correct morals. We're still learning. A documentary on National Geographic built a scale of civilizations' evolution from 1 to 5 considering all technology invented or in development at the moment that our civilization has not learned to use properly yet. The present human race was ranked "1" on that scale. We're not evil, we simply have potential that we don't know how to control. Humans, regarding technology and power are like children in a candy store (overexcited but innocent).

As long as the society is overall conscious of the wrong actions some of its citizens do and the laws stay, even if they are not firmly and entirely respected, humanity is greedy, power-thirsty, instinctive but not evil.

Quote from -Hawk-

I think the "evil" in cause, is actually "instinct". Basically, the human race is an animal race that has managed to create restraints for itself and to distinguish wrong from right. That started happening significantly ever since the first communities (eg. Ancient Greece). Humans are not overall evil, but overall natural and "wild" animals. Jutsu's thread supports this.
I don't think that random act's of fictional violence and murderous intend is justification for a point of view or natural. I wouldn't benifit out of it and I wasn't going to survive that way. If I was following my instincts I would have tried to find a way to survive not senselessly slaughter all the people I encountered. Just saying <.< People want to do a certain impulsive things, but in reality they would be restrained and stopped by society's regulations, which the SAME human race created FOR THEMSELVES.

I don't think we are evil for ruining the environment. In this case we've just been unaware of the results of our actions throughout time. Some of us have not been given the proper education and taught the correct morals. We're still learning. A documentary on National Geographic built a scale of civilizations' evolution from 1 to 5 considering all technology invented or in development at the moment that our civilization has not learned to use properly yet. The present human race was ranked "1" on that scale. We're not evil, we simply have potential that we don't know how to control. Humans, regarding technology and power are like children in a candy store (overexcited but innocent).

As long as the society is overall conscious of the wrong actions some of its citizens do and the laws stay, even if they are not firmly and entirely respected, humanity is greedy, power-thirsty, instinctive but not evil.

Yes but the craving for more power and greed is the main drivetrain for the machine of destruction known as the human mind. If you didn't have any reason to do something, not even for the sheer fun like in my post, than why would you do it? You wouldn't do it, because you wouldn't have a reason to. Without those things there would be no evil and since humanity is oozing out the poors with this I will stand by my oppinion that I believe humanity is evil. Even subconciously mankind does evil things, I can believe that everyone has thoughts of killing someone from time to time. One would argue that it doesn't actually happen, but you still think about it and it reaches a point that you would actually want to do it. Than the thought crosses your mind (I would get arrested or that's frowned upon) If you where freed from all law, you would do it at any chance you could to get whatever you want to live life comfortably. You act like it's instinct but it sounds like evil to me.

If humanity didn't frown upon that sort of thing than it wouldn't be considered evil at all. Lynching witches and people of different skin color or people of other religions were all not considered evil, especially the last one. They praised themselves for killing heathens. But now that society doesn't like it we consider that evil. Face it if you do something horrible out of greed or crave for power than you are evil, just like the rest of humanity. If you are in the odd bunch that doesn't seem to be a destructive monster, than you're shit out of luck because you obviously must not be too instinctual huh? No you're just one of the few who won't do whatever it takes to make yourself more satesfied no matter how many fingers you smash on your way up the latter, just too realize that those who you stepped on are going to be the ones you have to answer to when some son of a bitch sends you flying back down. Just so he can have that new job postition or because he want's the insurance money.

Whenever I get the thoughts or urges to hurt, kill, maim, etc it doesn't ever take me long to think about the pain and suffering that would cause to the victim and to the family/friends. Then I think about how much I'd have to go through explaining myself to everyone and how I'd have to try getting away with it and what if I didn't? etc

I think I at least put the right thoughts first.

Quote from Jutsu

Yes but the craving for more power and greed is the main drivetrain for the machine of destruction known as the human mind. If you didn't have any reason to do something, not even for the sheer fun like in my post, than why would you do it? You wouldn't do it, because you wouldn't have a reason to. Without those things there would be no evil and since humanity is oozing out the poors with this I will stand by my oppinion that I believe humanity is evil.

Those acts of violence are due to certain stress factors or a mental illness. A normal person does not simply kill somebody else. Those that you described are special cases of criminals. They went through difficult situations or stress which got them mentally ill, therefore, not normal. We are discussing the entire race here, the common human.
So you are saying that without instincts there would be no evil? That makes no sense. Instincts are natural, evil is a psychological matter.

"It sounds like evil", you're not being convincing here. There is scientific proof to murderous actions. The human psychology is far more complex than you seem to think. Murders aren't always done out of hatred. They are sometimes done for self-defence (victim kills the criminal to save their own life). That is an example of when the fear factor triggers the instincts.
As regarding craving for power and greed, have as an example a pack of wolves: The alpha male takes his position partially thanks to these two characteristics. So then, are animals evil too? I don't think so. These characteristics are part of the base of leadership and social status. Murders are just a desperate way to achieve a goal, not a general method.

There is a great difference between thinking, wishing and acting. A person who actually thinks evilishly but doesn't act that way realizes the consequences of his actions and controls itself, therefore, acts morally and controlled.

"Lynching witches and people of different skin color or people of other religions" We don't have death penalty for withcraft anymore, hating other races is called "racism" and has nothing to do with murder, but is a mere case of discrimination and social status. There are, indeed, arguments between people of different religions, which can get to murder, but the murder is done to overpower the religion they are against. I'm talking about a case such as the Gaza strip here. Basically, in the past, death penalty was applied to witches because people were afraid of their apparent powers, different skin color people were being discriminated while killing for religion was a case of "disagreement".

Quote from Jutsu

If you are in the odd bunch that doesn't seem to be a destructive monster, than you're shit out of luck because you obviously must not be too instinctual huh?

Instincts are triggered. If you don't commit anything bad, you obviously have had no reason to. Besides, consider the fact that human beings have something called "self-control", which besides laws stops them from killing. Self-control is a very clear example of why humanity is not evil. Consider simple, numerous cases such as people returning found lost objects or money of other people.
The rest of what you said made no sense to me. Basically, as you stated, humans SHOULD try to overpower each other as much as possible to be successful. I strongly disagree to that, and I think it would lead to a dystopia. Why on earth would people not work together well, and instead constantly conspire against each other? We are intelligent enough to realize the potential of teamwork.
I don't know what kind of a society you live in, Jutsu, but you sure have a really wrong and dramatic opinion on humanity.

The words good and evil were only thought up by people that wanted to rule other people. Anyone that opposed them were evil. Everyone that joined them was good.

But good and evil don't exist. They just don't. Don't really know a good argument to back it up though..

Oh hey, that quote is from my thread. I guess in some cases this may relate to what I wrote? I'm not sure.

Either way, I don't believe humanity is evil. Thoughts are one thing. Actions are another. If humanity were evil the laws of society would have been overthrown and a lot more chaos would be being commenced. Think about it, the laws were created by humans. The force that stops the chaos are humans. Why do they do it? Because they believe that it's the right thing to do. Humanity is complicated and shouldn't be grouped together as an entire individual personality. Humanity is made of billions of different individuals. Thats billions of different personalities and opinions. The examples that you used are reasonable, but the causes of that are practically about 5 different people who have influenced hundreds more. Which brings me to my next topic. People are the way they are because of what they've seen or heard. Obviously one day Hitler didn't wake up and be like "I'm going to go destroy the jewish population and rule the world." Obviously he was influenced by personal experience as a child/adult that made him believe that his decisions were right. The reason many people think of all these horrid ways of how to obtain and pursue things are generated because your mind thinks. Your mind is able to process around 1000 things every second. Obviously within those few seconds the brain can think up a scenario on how you can do something in the worst way possible. But just because you thought of this doesn't make you evil. It was just a thought that came to mind. And practically 75 percent of people usually brush it off within the first minute of the thought. Then out of the the remaining 25 percent, 23 percent don't do it. Then 1 percent of the remaining 2 back out of it before commencing. The reason I left 1 percent(which is still a large amount of people) is because I didn't feel like going into decimals. My point is, is that humanity is not evil because a thought comes to mind. Humanity isn't evil period. There are just evil people out there who were influenced into becoming evil, and makes everyone think, "Gawrsh, if he and like 5 other people did it, then humanity is horrible! D:"

Is Humanity evil? In fact they are. If you think about i, What do people crave the most? Lust,power, money fame. How would they get all though things. By stepping on some one else for it, Also by lying and cheating. and you can not tell me this is not true. there are people in politics, people in religion, even in normal life. So don't tell me people are saints, we are no where close. and if you can deny any of this you completely are in a fantasy

i crave to play video games, am i evil?

Quote from tekushikume

Is Humanity evil? In fact they are. If you think about i, What do people crave the most? Lust,power, money fame. How would they get all though things. By stepping on some one else for it, Also by lying and cheating. and you can not tell me this is not true. there are people in politics, people in religion, even in normal life. So don't tell me people are saints, we are no where close. and if you can deny any of this you completely are in a fantasy

These are the kind of people I was talking about in my post. They just expect the worst of humanity. And they don't even base it off fact. They just base it off their beliefs and such.

Quote from tekushikume

Is Humanity evil? In fact they are. If you think about i, What do people crave the most? Lust,power, money fame. How would they get all though things. By stepping on some one else for it, Also by lying and cheating. and you can not tell me this is not true. there are people in politics, people in religion, even in normal life. So don't tell me people are saints, we are no where close. and if you can deny any of this you completely are in a fantasy

I wouldn't harm someone to get lust, power, money fame. There you go, your theory is disproven. Besides which, who are you to say stepping on someone to get those things is evil?