EvO note: these setups will be the bulk of your army. use support when needed
Charrog/Air or ChAir

+provides safety from melee units
+units can be qued without affecting the amount of the other, making this time efficient.
+air units will hit targets 100 percent if the units they target come within its range making enemy tanks useless
- requires a steady eco


Charrog/Fire

+an ele spear arch of sorts, but a little more tanky
+able to kite unlike ChAir (Chairs cant kite)
-vulnerable to mass rage swords and greater range units that can kite as well. except giants
-merics can tank fires sadly.

Tree/Air

+very cost effective
+melee units spawn constantly for a long as trees live over time
+delivers an inevasive strike and a passive poison effect with upgrades
-early units are vulnerable
-healing unit is used for tree creation
- scorps cant really tank airs
-Aoe is a bitch
+slow moving units are susceptible to pain without protection.

Tree/Fire

+two passive damages: poison and burn
+shuts out melee for the most part
-flying units used in conjunction with aoe.
-fails to kill units quickly behind structures or statue. walls and statue are super tanks.
-archers have greater range advantage making second row difficult to optain if turtling

EvC
Charrog/Cycloid

+Tanky Tanky
+deals with wings if heavy on cycloids
+deals with deads if heavy on charrogs
-both units cant do the others' job
-units appear later than when they may be needed
-very costly
Tree/cycloid
+delivers poison to enemy units
+nullifies almost everything except wings
(Trees do)
+cycloid take wings
-waters have to be constantly macroed into either trees,cycloids, or healing units.
-both use melee primarily so micro is heavy. (Avoid space bar)
Charrog/Fire
+takes out heavy armored units quickly. Ie. deads and juggers
-bombs can rush fires quickly ( spreading these doesn't seem to help much)
+burn does some noticeable damage vs dat auto heal.
+ at Max range fires can dodge wing projectiles pretty well.
-low armored units tank more than heavy oddly enough.
Cannot priority target units very well.

EvE
Tree/Air
+4 airs pretty much is a gg as trees can't hit airs, other airs insta die, fires die to either 4-5 of these. (After ts1 you can ignore fires for the most part)
+scorps: poison. Scorps repeatedly spawn, repeatedly poison, repeatedly force opponent to either garrison units or spend 350 on a healing/curing/non damaging unit only to be poisoned again.
+damn fast army
-have to get before opponent does
-tree cycloid counters well.
Tree/cycloid
+suppresses ground almost entirely
+cycloids can wipe airs away with a few tornado spells due to air inability to kite.
-slower than tree/air
-costly macro wise and Eco wise

@That1Gamer
add some shit plz

What about CyVoid (Cycloid+V)? There's also no build involving inferno or V yet here. ._.

because those are support and will never appear as consistently

Why not post in the elementals section?

general section gets more feedback

Amazing reference, bookmarked for use when eles are playable again. Thanks.

Ele's are always playable.
You just need to learn how they work.
I used to think they were OP at first.
Then I realized they had massive flaws.
Then I thought they started to kinda become underpowered in some aspects.
I discovered I was wrong.
By exploiting their strengths you can make up in their problem areas.
Order only has range advantage with archers.
Using charrogs you can easily compensate by pressing archers back into a tighter space where their range matters not.
Chaos vs ele has it's weaknesses and strengths both players can exploit.

Quote from pumuecils

Ele's are always playable.
You just need to learn how they work.
I used to think they were OP at first.
Then I realized they had massive flaws.
Then I thought they started to kinda become underpowered in some aspects.
I discovered I was wrong.
By exploiting their strengths you can make up in their problem areas.
Order only has range advantage with archers.
Using charrogs you can easily compensate by pressing archers back into a tighter space where their range matters not.
Chaos vs ele has it's weaknesses and strengths both players can exploit.

sorry in my mind ele is still not playable.
I have never lose "even" once when facing elemental if the game lasts more than 6 minutes.

That means elemental only has a chance in the beginning of the match, in the late game, it is definitely a death of elemental

show a replay. i want to see their rank, start, macro, and yours. give me a few of you playing some 2.3k or above ele losing. if isee tree fire its obvious how they lost. expendable gold spam.

Quote from pumuecils

Ele's are always playable.

Using charrogs you can easily compensate by pressing archers back into a tighter space where their range matters not.

Grass hills anyone?


EvC still not viable even slightly unless elems can insta win at start game

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay6333960&version=2.08

There is simply no gold or time efficient way to respond - you can see I even started Cycloids and Charrogs first, but got out numbered very quickly.

Quote from pumuecils

show a replay. i want to see their rank, start, macro, and yours. give me a few of you playing some 2.3k or above ele losing. if isee tree fire its obvious how they lost. expendable gold spam.

Last time I played Rain once with elemental
And he brought out an order deathball (Giants + magkill + merics + ninjas) , I just tried all types of builds and had no chance to win it at all

the game lasted for like 25 minutes, and so the replay did not work .

But I am sure, once order deathball comes out, or wing mass with medusa support, there is no chance for ele to win
I can give you lose streak if you don't trust my claim , just send me a challenge whenever you see me online

Quote from pumuecils

show a replay. i want to see their rank, start, macro, and yours. give me a few of you playing some 2.3k or above ele losing. if isee tree fire its obvious how they lost. expendable gold spam.

I hate to gloat over a single win I might not have pulled off consistently over many games, but here's a 1.8k me beating a 2.1k that went full Cycloid macro and landed almost all of their Cycloid AoEs after an Air start that actually pressured me quite a bit.

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay6345126&version=2.09

My eclip spam nearly handled the cycloids but I threw in a medusa (which they countered by careful shielding quite well) and then a giant (and I would have medusa'd any v trying to take it) which AoE stuned all their cycloids as they were trying to stun lock my eclips. Literally, once Chaos gets up the eclip spam Elementals have no response because the few options they would have Chaos can shut down fast.

Also if you do the math a 750|100 cost Cycloid versus a 400|150 cost eclipsor with the cycloid buying also preventing simultaneous purchases of waters or airs and you can see why elems loses the massing game fast. Spamming fires alongside brings the cost up way past what the eco can bring in at mid game.

Edit: I may have found something that works just occasionally.
www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay6346932&version=2.09

At the cost of a 1350|100 semi rush to get in just as the Chaos starts with wing spam you steal an eclipsor taking 400|100 away from Chaos and effectively gaining it yourself for a 800|200 offset. Nurse the v to keep it alive and finally Elementals have viable air units!
-This is a joke by the way, the only reason it worked in that replay was because my eco was so ahead.

The mentioning of medusa makes me sick vs ele.
I can see the potential of poison but marrow and wings makes more sense. I can simply go tree cycloid. Focusing directly on your Eco and priority units and the cycloids handle the wings.
Full cycloid is retarded due to the fact that that they have no way afterward to inflict massive damage to turrets and miners after handling wings.
A handful of repeated Scorp sieges and cycloids handle that.

The best way to handle the deathball is to prevent it.
The deathball isn't consistent. Ele has a variety of tools it can use to break the turtles.
Explain the beginning of the turtle to the end from the order viewpoint.
Using ChAir shadows and albows don't exist.
Merics don't influence air damage much as it's pretty rapid damage.
If I decide to spawn a v or infern i make sure I have enough to insta snipe shadows at least and a water just in case.
Magikill and archers? V.

(I noticed most ele players neglect to prevent order players from touching second row.)
Any games y'all played that the ele player left your Eco alone?
Or didn't even pay attention to you?

Quote from pumuecils

The mentioning of medusa makes me sick vs ele.
I can see the potential of poison but marrow and wings makes more sense. I can simply go tree cycloid. Focusing directly on your Eco and priority units and the cycloids handle the wings.

(I noticed most ele players neglect to prevent order players from touching second row.)
Any games y'all played that the ele player left your Eco alone?
Or didn't even pay attention to you?

Lel, marrokais can't interrupt spell casts - Medusa is a lot safer for anti v.
Plus medusa can snipe off any cycloid that doesn't shield, forcing them to sheild at the start of encounter, letting me just run away with my eclips and tear them apart as their shields die.

I find pressuring an opponent with castle units much more challenging to do with ele's ludicrous short range and the airs basically taking 4 seconds to retarget. Miners can kite fire projectiles because the things are so darn slow.

That said on castle EvO|C I can earth tank dive quite well and keep up the pressure, but even then I'm using one inconsistent strength that doesn't work nearly as well on larger maps to deal with a constant weakness of having no reliable ranged attacks.

Quote from Skeletonxf

Medusa is a lot safer for anti v.

I disagree completely.

Control kicks in before stone. Medusa poison on wings is a sure-kill. Shield stops Stone face cold. Once a V controls a medusa a unit is FOR SURE dead.