I know I did something like this before, pre-spam-o-matic. But now I've refined it even more. My question is, in any or all RPGs, what is that thing that irks you the most but you still play it anyway because it's a damn good game (or it just sucks bad and you have to finish it anyway)?

Share stories about your Worst RPG Gaming Experience. Whether it be an inefficiently difficult boss battle, a questline that gave you irritating difficulty, or just minor gripes you have for a game. Let's hear em.

Note that I'm referring to stuff that is meant to be normal gameplay, so fighting Bonus Bosses that are meant to be hard is beyond the scope of this poll/thread.

Man this is a tough decision. I guess I'll just share my thoughts first. Can this just be about game mechanics in general? Because I feel that some of these are applicable beyond that genre.

Grinding. And bad level distribution that would lead you to Grind.
- Grinding, if done right, doesn't have to be all tedious. Kingdom Hearts for example, I loved leveling because there were great and observable incentives to do so. E.g. you gained new abilities such as glide (which was fricken awesome), not just stat boosts. Even with stat boosts it made you feel more powerful and there were noticeable differences. Persona made it interesting as when you defeated an enemy, you were given a chance to unlock new cards. Pokemon, however. Jesus. I hated grinding in that game. It felt more like a chore then a game. Especially when you have these slow dialogue boxes that appear.

Pointless Menial/Fetch Quests
- If fetch quests are done right, it will be more about the journey then the destination. I mean Skyrim had plenty of Fetch Quests, but I found it entertaining because you could explore. But of course there are the shitty ones. I didn't realize this until years after revisiting Kingdom Hearts, but I remember in no. 1 in the beginning you had to wonder around getting coconuts, fish, logs... I mean, what the fuck? Why? While it was tied to the story, it seemed so trivial, I don't see why it couldn't have been accomplished with the cutscene. Sometimes, progressing a story line maybe not seem a worthy enough incentive to do trivial shit.

One-Hit Kill Cheapos (instances where the game doesn't warn you and you just die)
- I'm not sure if X-COM is considered RPG, but it is somewhat similar to Fire Emblem in that deaths result in permanent loss. In these games, cheapo kills are definitely BS. Leveling your troop to commander, then bust through a door to see three mother fucken Ethereals. MASSIVE loss of progress. There should be build up or stories littered along your journey where it warns you of these enemies. Not only will it make you more cautious, but the moment you bump into one of them you will get this "OH SHIT!!!" feeling rather then, I can take it followed shortly by "THIS IS FUCKEN BULLSHIT!!!" I find the prior reaction is far more desirable as it adds tension rather then feelings of frustration.

Backtracking / Lack of Proper Waypointing
- This happened to me with Final Fantasy 7 where I had to find a battery to progress to the next stage (I think). The graphics were obviously not great compared to today's standards, so I spent ages walking around clicking X to find it. Likewise in the older Resident Evil games, sometimes I had to wonder around the entire mansion 10 times in order to find something that I might have overlooked. It was like I was spending time in a virtual world finding something that I lost. FRICK! Absolutely rage inducing and potentially a game killer. Luckily today there are guides that can resolve the issue so it isn't as big of a problem.

Dungeon Puzzles that are either too easy or too hard
- I just hate puzzles in general.

EDIT: Unfair bosses
Things I hate:
. Multiple forms without checkpoint system.
. Bullshit automatic decrease health to 1 and unavoidable attacks. LOOKING AT YOU SEPHIROTH.
. Automatic health recover when low. LOOKING AT YOU GYM LEADERS.

Done. I'll change the title. Mod, someone please change the poll title to omit the RPG portion.

And I'll share some personal gripes later.

I had the same case with Envoy about FF7's backtracking. I stopped playing it for a long time (it's so frustating) before looking up a video, and the exit is really just out of the screen. I searched every nook and cranny, looking for the exit to the next location, searched for things that was never there. It's really shitty.

My gripe with FF7 was Sephiroth's moves. It had this very long animation. It was tedious to watch after the first few uses. When you came back after losing it felt as if Sephiroth was mocking you for not defeating him the first time.

For me, the fetch quests were okay unless they were things like "Gather some worms so I can fish." If it was about, get the holy sword of the saviour it would be better.

Quote from Envoy

Backtracking / Lack of Proper Waypointing
- This happened to me with Final Fantasy 7 where I had to find a battery to progress to the next stage (I think). The graphics were obviously not great compared to today's standards, so I spent ages walking around clicking X to find it. Likewise in the older Resident Evil games, sometimes I had to wonder around the entire mansion 10 times in order to find something that I might have overlooked. It was like I was spending time in a virtual world finding something that I lost. FRICK! Absolutely rage inducing and potentially a game killer. Luckily today there are guides that can resolve the issue so it isn't as big of a problem.

Quote from _Ai_

I had the same case with Envoy about FF7's backtracking. I stopped playing it for a long time (it's so frustating) before looking up a video, and the exit is really just out of the screen. I searched every nook and cranny, looking for the exit to the next location, searched for things that was never there. It's really shitty.

That's more of the game's faulty level design than actual backtracking. Backtracking refers to parts where you know where to go but because there aren't any checkpoints you are left to have to run all the way back without so much as a changing event. An example of this is in Quake 2 where after I kill all the enemies, the real objective is actually a lock and key hunt. So I would need to acquire a to put in door b to get key c etc. And after being cautious about enemies, I am just left wandering empty halls on the ways back and forth. Another example is Diablo II's 3rd act where you're just basically plopped into the jungle to look for macguffins until you can move the plot forward. If you missed a waypoint then fuck you, you gotta go back to town and start over.

But the most egregious example is the Chrono Trigger remake on the DS. They have this extra quest exclusive to the DS port where you literally just go back and forth through time looking for a key item (so it doubles as a fetch quest). The annoying part is each time you need to go back to the lizard cave to give the key items you actually have to traverse FOUR screens of nothing (no enemies, no shortcuts, etc.). Oh and when you give the items back you have to walk out THE SAME WAY...so that's EIGHT screens! That's not including the screens where you call your time machine to travel to another era, to goto a place, to get that object and move back out. And your reward for all that? Sub-par gear. Since you unlock this scenario late into the endgame, doing the quest itself is pointless and only serves to remind us that this DS port is different.

I think I see what you mean. Would you consider Dead Rising games as back tracking + fetch quest? It involves you picking up survivors and running all the way back to the safe house. I could be mistaken but the load times when moving to different maps were quite abysmal. Luckily the map wasn't designed in a way where it forced you through a corridor of different areas and there were means to get a short cut. Which reminds me, escort missions. They annoy the hell out of me. Using the same example, the AI would usually run slower then you, they would definitely be weaker then you, and sometimes they do stupid shit instead of following you. I can't think of any games on the top of my head who managed to do it right, but there has to be some.

Also another thing that annoys me is random enemies. You know, Pokemon in the grass, Final Fantasy walk x distance and face an enemy, stuff like that. If I had the money, I would buy all the repels I could because that shit got annoying. And also, combine that with the Pokemon stage where you have to walk through the cave and only have a radius of 3 squares in front of you. FUCK! Games like Persona and I think the later FF (I'm not really a follower of FF so I'm only speaking from observation) gave you a choice to either strike the enemy or try to squeeze your way past through it rather then force you to fight. It's less time consuming and saves you the trouble of pressing RUN every single time.

the cliffhangers are the worst part of RPGs.. Everything else making them harder is part of their beauty. I'd prefer a increadibly hard to beat game that'll consume take my time and make me feel good after beating it than a 5hours storyline game with easy bosses and legendery items every corner..

Luck in a game, ESPECIALLY RPG's can really ruin the experience for me. Critical hits, one hit kill moves etc. It's just annoying as hell because it's usually the computer that always gets really lucky. No matter how skilled you are, luck can just turn it all around and fuck you up :<

Quote from Hewitt

Why? Because they break the pace? Because you are too arsed to solve them? I find puzzles in a dungeon to be fine as long as it doesnt destroy the rhythm of the game and if the design makes sense. In Skyrim, I used to think that the dragon claw puzzles were stupid until I realized they were retardedly easy for a reason: to keep the undead out (because they wouldnt be able to figure it out).

You guessed it. Personally it's just a matter of taste. I never really enjoyed puzzles probably because I saw it as an obstacle preventing me from doing what I really wanted to do i.e. the combat. I don't mind if puzzles are optional and that completing them gives you perks, e.g. Bioshock had those mini hacking puzzles where you connected the pipes, but forced ones made me felt slowed down (probably due to my own ineptitude) when it is a part of progressing the story. Another example I can think of is in Resident evil 4. While I never played the game I watched my friend go through the colour puzzle.

It was by no means a bad puzzle, but I could imagine feeling quite frustrated trying to solve it. Bizarrely, I can play games like Portal fine. Perhaps it relates to my mentality when I go into the game.

And your point about unskippable tutorials remind me of another thing. Unskippable cutscenes or scenes that deliberately make your character move more slowly. It was the number one reason why I didn't get past the first level of Resident evil 6. There is also the issue (such as in COD) where you basically have to follow an NPC who is waaaaaay slower then you in order to progress to the next level.

Grinding.
Anyone knows the game Vindictus? Secret tip free-2-play game, hack and slay with an awesome fight system. Much fun to play. But after the first 40 levels its nothing but grinding...

Grinding is one of the reasons why I don't get too interested in many RPGs.
I never got a level 100 on Pokemon all on my own because of how tedious it is to constantly fight without making that much EXP progression.