Fuck it, let's see where this goes.

I'm sure majority of us will agree the amount of poison going around ever since Mike joined the forums is getting out of hand. He's a pathological liar claiming to have a mental illness. This may or may not but the case, but in the magical internet-land there is no way we can know for certain whether or not he's actually retarded or just this socially awkward. I know most of us don't even read the kid's posts anymore, and if we do we don't respond. Still, it's incredibly hard to hold back telling some kid off when he says something retarded, and to be perfectly honest that's unhealthy. People should be called out on their shit so they know how to better themselves and be a better user for the community's sake, but unfortunately with Mike there really is no cure for his shit-posting.

The point of this thread is to gain input and come to a conclusion about the "Mike problem" once and for all since obviously we don't know what's being done behind the scenes about it. Personally I feel like we're better off without the kid. No one had a problem when we permabanned Harvie for the same shit, and the community was ultimately better off without the dude. This is not a hate/flame thread, so don't come in here venting about how you hate the kid for being autistic, even though we all agree with you except for Bat-Woman. Simply vote in the poll whether or not you feel like he should be allowed to stay or if we should ban this kid indefinitely. Post below to give valid reasoning as to why you feel the way you do, that way as a fucking community we can figure this shit out once and for all and do what's best for everyone.

I don't know anything about this guy.. But I really do think this should probably be posted as a private thread among staff instead of publicly posting for everyone to see and potentially humiliating someone who may have a disability. The staff can decide what to do about it and apply it to any future cases like these lol..

I didn't know we could ostracize people from here :\

Quote from Miccool

I don't know anything about this guy..

Lemme just recap most of this situation for you. It started when a guy called Mike9714 (or numbers like that, jesus christ I hate number names) joined stickpage and started asking for a moderator job in the SE thread. To prove himself, he started to "spam" around the place just so he could get what he believed was to be known among the forum and liked by the members. The SE members were not pleased, and continued to deny him this position. Since he had already posted in places like the general forum, he moved over here and started posting. Few tens of posts at everyone's annoyance, he starts saying that he has a mental disablity. Also said something about being a soldier in the army, but was disproven by Azure Kite when he explained that it was a wikipedia image. I'd explain more but I'm just looking from the outside in.


To be honest, I don't know why you would let him stay. If he is such an annoyance, is the only reason he's staying around is because someone believes he/she/it can be "changed" or is it because he is pitied because of his supposed disablity? Either one seems stupid.

Quote from Miccool

I don't know anything about this guy.. But I really do think this should probably be posted as a private thread among staff instead of publicly posting for everyone to see and potentially humiliating someone who may have a disability. The staff can decide what to do about it and apply it to any future cases like these lol..

I agree, but the truth is this has been an issue for weeks. I know most of the people here dislike the guy, and we all ignore his posts to the best of our abilities, but it's hard to ignore the kid when he posts some shit that you can't just let go. In my opinion, from what I've seen over the past few weeks, his presence here has caused more problems than it should have. This thread was someone else's idea back when Mike first became an issue in the chat thread. Most of us agreed that it would be better for everyone to not have the guy around. I don't see how this is humiliating. If he looks at this and can change how he is for everyone's sake, then good for him, that's awesome. The fact is he's already been flamed and ridiculed in other places around the forum so I don't see how this is much worse. I don't want this to be a thread where everyone hates on the kid, but I feel like majority of the intellectual users whose input really matters aren't part of the moderation team.

If he is really autistic, and what is he doing just annoy everyone else..
Well , this is not a place for him.

One thing I have to point out is your use of the word retarded which is pretty offensive assuming he could have a legitimate mental illness.
Now we don't know whether or not he does, so unless proven that he does have a real issue I say we ban him. If he does have a real problem though that does not mean we let his mistakes slide. We still gotta call him out on mistakes and still possibly ban him.

Here are my points on the matter that I think everyone should read. They are neither for nor against the banning:

Point 1: To the Mods/Jeff, did we not have a situation like this ages ago in the BatChat when I wasn't a mod yet? During the Merge, 2 particular users were causing trouble but weren't technically being malicious on purpose. Ahmad (in his pre-Salt days) and some other guy as I recall. The decision was that while well-meaning to the community, their language barrier and constant failure to understand the rules were being a bother to all the users involved. The mods then saddled the pair with a final warning, and failed it naturally causing their quick exit. Ahmad would show up many ages later, eventually transforming into the Salt we know today. That proved that people can change and their previous counterparts couldn't. So we do have and had provisions for cases like this.

Point 2: Arch. There something you should know:
- Mike and harvie are both retards but they are also both different. harvie was constantly being an infraction magnet because he kept ignoring the rules. Worse, he was aware of his own autism and used this to his advantage. Mike is just trying to be friendly. But apparently everyone just sees autistic child and calls them all the same thing.
- You keep saying that Cami is protecting Mike and its biased as hell, well guess what, I was also protecting harvie way back then. You think I didn't want to ban that little turd the moment he decided to give the Chat Thread a migraine from hell? That's just not the Post-Merge way/ Just as I am seeing Mike's potential to change, I was also very patient with harvie. I was even very apologetic about it in the Batcave when it happened---I felt terrible about like I just killed a child with my bare hands. I gave harvie LOTS of chances and special treatments too and I really tried to help him out. The same for Reconcile/Guitarii. So don't go on saying that this time it's different.

Point 3: You guys can't see it like I do, because honestly I was meticulous back then. Did it feel like the harvie-age was a breeze of forgotten memories and I just easily lifted your worries with a simple ban? Fuck no. It's because I always went and deleted every errant post generated by the guy. I always PM-ed harvie about his situation. I always stood by this and monitored his progress. I watched the Chat Thread and every thread like a hawk and I made sure it was always business as usual. But after months of no-change I finally had it and decided it was better off to see him go as it did the community more good and it's not like he even had an RHG or did art and animated. Now maybe Cami's methods are not the same, but it's not fair to judge her now just because she's the only one doing to infracting. In the first place, she's the only generally active core mod right now. In the 2nd place, the Batcave is as I mentioned composed of multiple mods and while the Sectionals may not have power, they also contribute to this and we just don't know it. But Arch knows this. So what the fuck, man?

Point 4: Cami's advice to ignore him is not new. I don't understand this part and I don't know why you should demonize Cami over it. I always suggested this in the Chat Thread even before harvie/Reconcile. Back when the fearsome five was wrecking things too. Unlike harvie, mike is just confused and well-meaning. You can't fault this guy for anything. So just leave him alone and he'll get a clue soon enough.



With that said, I am very neutral on this issue. I'd prefer he stayed, because I'm treating him like I once treated harvie. I sympathize. But at the same time, he should have a probationary period where if he continues to disrupt this community for whatever reason---even the reasons that aren't infractible, like pre-Salt/Ahmad's confused culture clash---then he ought to be booted from this place for the common good.

Just because Camila is doing the same thing you're doing doesn't make it alright, why should he get special treatment for being a bad user. That just doesn't make any sense to me at all. Why does he get an abundance of chances when it's clear and pretty much has always been clear how he fits in around here. He just doesn't. This is what I said in the ban registrar thread

Quote from Drone

I don't get this whole "leave him alone" or "ignore him" thing one bit. He never makes any posts (not threads) worth acknowledging unless they're completely idiotic, so for the most part he gets ignored pretty much every time he posts anything. And if that's the case, why is he even here? If literally the only way he can contribute to a discussion is by saying sonething downright idiotic then for what purpose is he even around? To make more pseudo chat threads that he can be ignored in yet again? Like shit man, his speedometer only goes from 0 to 50 in constant reverse, is that worth keeping around

If the only way he can fit in is by being ignored then he just cannot fit in at all. And I don't think he's all that "confused and well meaning" either or "just trying to make friends" after that whole tirade in the chat thread about him being a navy seal. He definitely knew what he was doing then, and he knew it was wrong because he apologized to Exilement afterwards, so what, was that part of his well meaning friend making as well? This kid is a cancer, theres nothing good about him, at the best he's benign, as he's been for maybe a few days while making a few threads that admittedly stirred discussion, (but in all those threads he's utterly ignored. In his own threads.) but at worst he's a straight up tumor in this community, and I can't name a single user that LIKES him. Not tolerates him. Not lets him be. Genuinely enjoys his presence.

I'll make a longer post once I'm back at my computer about yours hewitt, but I agree with the similarities between him and harvie, and I'm not just trying to hate on the guy for his disability. I'm also not saying cami is doing anything wrong, but given the circumstances she is not the person for the job because she's going to be completely bias and take it way too personally.

Character, mind explaining your reasoning for letting him stay?

Yeah like I said in the other thread, the drama he's generated is so ridiculous that it's not even entertaining in the least. I guess he hasn't technically done anything wrong according to the rules, but his stunt of lying about a cousin, then say sorry for lying, THEN lie about being in the Navy Seal, is just so dumb that there's no other way for anyone to ever take him seriously. He claims he's fucking over twenty years of age ffs, and if that's true then there's no way he can improve after months/years of trying. If it's a lie, then he's 9 and should not be here. If he's over 13, then he's facing the eventual fate of getting axed anyway.

I'd argue that Ahmad can at least communicate properly. I'm looking at his post on Rosie's RHG and a few other of his old posts and it seems that even though he hasn't been making such a great impression on the General Section, at least he was active in the RHG Section and wasn't completely unlikable.

Quote from Hewitt

Here are my points on the matter that I think everyone should read. They are neither for nor against the banning:

Point 1: To the Mods/Jeff, did we not have a situation like this ages ago in the BatChat when I wasn't a mod yet? During the Merge, 2 particular users were causing trouble but weren't technically being malicious on purpose. Ahmad (in his pre-Salt days) and some other guy as I recall. The decision was that while well-meaning to the community, their language barrier and constant failure to understand the rules were being a bother to all the users involved. The mods then saddled the pair with a final warning, and failed it naturally causing their quick exit. Ahmad would show up many ages later, eventually transforming into the Salt we know today. That proved that people can change and their previous counterparts couldn't. So we do have and had provisions for cases like this.

Wow what the fuck I was that bad.
There was never a language barrier I was just an idiot lmao.

I loved you then and I love you know, salty babe <3