The problem puts things into a kind of weird spot. For as much as he deserves it, infracting would be causing backwards progress on where we want him to go. Because things were so tense, that infraction might be what makes him explode all over again.

If everyone agrees that he needs to be infracted, I'd at least like to be the one who does it. He won't blow up on me.

Since when do we care if people explode with infractions or not?. If they don't like it well them too bad, they better learn to behave better.

Again, we can explain in a really polite way and tell him that he can appeal to it if he feels like AT LEAST apologising for what he did.

But leave him without an infraction seems ridiculous to me.

Quote from Camila

Since when do we care if people explode with infractions or not?. If they don't like it well them too bad, they better learn to behave better.

Again, we can explain in a really polite way and tell him that he can appeal to it if he feels like AT LEAST apologising for what he did.

But leave him without an infraction seems ridiculous to me.

We always cared. It's like how Azure doesn't like infracting older members and you don't like infracting Hewitt.

Even then, this seems to be a bit different than that. When he suddenly lashed at the mods too, it was from a large feeling of being fed up with how the mods were handling things. This doesn't mean he's right, but it means that an infraction will lead to a public outburst and more problems down the line, when it just looked like we proved him wrong about not being able to get along with the mods. Infracting him will cause nothing good to come from it, and it won't help caelo either because she won't see if we did it or not. What's important is getting results.

It might be good to have another opinion here. My opinion might be biased because Jutsus a good friend of mine, and yours might be biased too because you're mad at him.

Edit: it's also worth mentioning that the post you want to infract him for has already been warned. We can't warn him as a caution thing and then suddenly infract him for it

I freaking love Jutsu. What the hell are you talking about. I want the best for him as well, but I can't let that affect my decision into what is fair and what not. I really have no problems to separate these thig and I'm not angry at anyone. I just want things to be fair, that's all I want.

And you can't tell me that let him go without an infraction is fair.

Damn, he might not even give a crap and actually recognise his fault which will give an excellent oportunity to talk things out. And I think you're exagerating too much. Worst case scenario, he replies back defending his argument, and we will get another perfect chance to talk things out with him.

Caelo has been pissing jutsu off, but not in a massive outburst but slowly. As time passes, jutsu's patience gets thinner. As a result, he finally bursted.

Is it fair? Jutsu has been tolerating caelo, but one outburst led him to get an infraction but the reason to his outburst was caelo.

What the freak Ai. Please quote me the post that pissed off Jutsu SOOOO MUCH that he had to be a total ass to her. Please, go back and read what she said because I don't see anything that may have provoked him.

And if you dislike someone, just use the damn ignore button lol.

I understand what you're trying to say. I don't understand how is that an excuse to his exaggerated-douchebag-reaction.

In fact, why are you trying to excuse him?. How is any of this her fault in any way? By how Jutsu reacted to EVERYONE, Caelo just happened to be there when Jutsu felt like venting out all his pointless anger.

uhh no, he was talking about TV shows before caelo said something that triggered his outburst, I don't know why you're trying to make him seem like he's blindly attacking everyone. he turned it on you after you started patronizing him.

This is the first I've heard about caelo pissing anyone off, what has she done that's so bad? Genuinely asking, I'm clueless here.

I caught up with everything that happened in the chat thread, jutsu's reaction seems ridiculous but if he has a (very) good reason for being upset with her then I should probably figure out what that is before making any judgment calls.

Quote from Camila

I freaking love Jutsu. What the hell are you talking about. I want the best for him as well, but I can't let that affect my decision into what is fair and what not. I really have no problems to separate these thig and I'm not angry at anyone. I just want things to be fair, that's all I want.

And you can't tell me that let him go without an infraction is fair.

I'm not shooting for what's fair and not fair, I'm suggesting what might actually work. An infraction probably won't work. It's not about delivering justice for me, it's about teaching Jutsu and all other older members how to behave In ways that they'll actually listen to instead of continuing their behaviour until they get banned and leave like sss.
Don't forget I suggested a separate course of action. I'm not suggesting he gets away with it for free.

Damn, he might not even give a crap and actually recognise his fault which will give an excellent oportunity to talk things out. And I think you're exagerating too much. Worst case scenario, he replies back defending his argument, and we will get another perfect chance to talk things out with him.

This is a solid point and I like your plan, but we can do this easily through a neutral channel like PMs instead of am infraction.

Quote from _Ai_

Caelo has been pissing jutsu off, but not in a massive outburst but slowly. As time passes, jutsu's patience gets thinner. As a result, he finally bursted.

Is it fair? Jutsu has been tolerating caelo, but one outburst led him to get an infraction but the reason to his outburst was caelo.

Raptor thought that Caelo was annoying with her lying too. Jutsu still overreacted but it wasn't provoked. It was still an outburst after a lot of stifling the urge to call her out on it

This is a solid point and I like your plan, but we can do this easily through a neutral channel like PMs instead of am infraction.

Problem is if we just give him a PM he'd be getting away with it for free. Which is exaclty what you

I'm not suggesting he gets away with it for free.

and I don't want to happen.

I wouldn't call shooting Jutsu a PM about that stuff getting away for free. It's a disciplinary action, even if it doesn't leave the feeling of "punishment has been served" like an infraction might. It still tells him what's up and why what he did was wrong in good detail.

I'd totally like to hear what Exilement thinks. He probably has the most neutral view out of all of us.

I honestly think I got the right call. Also what makes you think that he'll change his attitude with one simple harmless PM about how he has to control himself next time.

Like, at least an infraction along with the message will ACTUALLY make him think about it a second time before raging like that again. He may not care about one infraction, but he does know that getting the same one regarding one specific issue multiple times may lead to worse, and only then he might actually try to change.

Quote from Camila

I honestly think I got the right call. Also what makes you think that he'll change his attitude with one simple harmless PM about how he has to control himself next time.

Like, at least an infraction along with the message will ACTUALLY make him think about it a second time before raging like that again. He may not care about one infraction, but he does know that getting the same one regarding one specific issue multiple times may lead to worse, and only then he might actually try to change.

I'm dubious about it being the right call. No one else has said they thought Jutsu should be infracted.
It also wouldn't be a PM that just says "Ayy buddy try not to get so mad next time. Cool?" like that seems to suggest :p Ahem...

we need to actually talk to him and get him to realize why being an ass isn't cool. And why using other methods to dispute with someone else is not just following the rules, but also much more effective at getting what they want to dispute settled.

It'd be pretty detailed, and written in a way that he'd actually try to see from our point of view, and actually agree that he should deal with problems differently. An infraction won't have the effect you want if they only get angry by it and they think they're in the right. And why does the response have to hurt? What's bad about it being harmless? What matters is that it might actually make Jutsu listen and change things up, which is what we want to accomplish. It's also a good method to use for other members that repeatedly get too hostile with newbs, like Nish and Cook who also don't respond well to infractions.

I'm starting to repeat myself. I'll wait for Acute or Exilement to say what they think.

Can you summarize what Caelo's doing that's so annoying? I'm still waiting to hear what's going on in that regard.