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Is God all-powerful?

Started by: The Mockingjay | Replies: 68 | Views: 5,700

Vorpal
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Jul 27, 2012 7:01 PM #706047
Goddamn this shit again?

Listen, it's pointless yo.

It's like how atheists want proof god exists, even though faith is believing without knowing. If there was a giant throne in the sky with his hand reaching down from the heavens you wouldn't have much choice now would you? Of course not.
Which wouldn't be faith, it wouldn't be choosing god, wouldn't be free will.


This argument is designed for humans to attempt to comprehend something that simply transcends our understanding. I don't think that it's fair to regulate said god to our simplistic language by using rudimentary word loops.

That's like if I asked someone if they are so smart that they can make a riddle they can't solve.

It's meaningless, it's just a loop.
DiPi
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Jul 27, 2012 7:02 PM #706048
To this, then, follows another question: are we completely sure that what's written in the bible is true?
Vorpal
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Jul 27, 2012 7:07 PM #706052
Quote from DiPi
To this, then, follows another question: are we completely sure that what's written in the bible is true?


As stated, faith is believing without knowing. If you're faithful it doesn't matter if it's true.


Of course don't confuse faith with religion, because religion is fucking retarded.


And no, we're pretty sure lots of the shit in the bible's been fucked up by translations and even more fucked up by the various additions/removals. Not even counting how people interpret the meanings.

In my opinion the best way to understand anything is to put yourself in the shoes of the writer. We read it and compare it to things we experience today, but we don't use their time period as a frame of reference, which would make things easier to understand.
angry birds159
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Jul 27, 2012 7:12 PM #706058
he can make anything dude
DiPi
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Jul 27, 2012 7:17 PM #706060
Quote from angry birds159
he can make anything dude


This is what you believe, but it's not possible to confirm its existance, as well as it's impossible to completely say that it doesn't exist: this is just an antinomy
Vorpal
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Jul 27, 2012 7:20 PM #706063
Sheep and agnostic alert guys.

I guess technically I fall into the realm of agnostic.
I don't believe in god really but I also don't not believe.

What is the term for someone who doesn't believe and doesn't not believe but also doesn't give a fuck if god does or does not exist?
Is it like...nihilgnostic?
MadMirrors
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Jul 27, 2012 7:28 PM #706065
It sounds like you have no faith on your god dipi.
Vorpal
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Jul 27, 2012 7:32 PM #706067
It's called Apatheism

This I do
Apathetic agnosticism (also called pragmatic agnosticism) acknowledges that thousands of years of debate have neither proven, nor disproven, the existence of one or more deities

This I don't
This view concludes that even if one or more deities exist, they do not appear to be concerned about the fate of humans. Therefore, their existence has little impact on personal human affairs and should be of little theological interest.
Saying it hasn't had an impact is blind, whether it exists or not. For example: The dark ages.

This I do
Apatheists hold that if it were possible to prove that God exists, their behavior would not change. Similarly, there would be no change if someone proved that God does not exist.

History
Historically, practical atheism was considered by some people to be associated with moral failure, willful ignorance, and impiety. Those considered practical atheists were said to behave as though God, ethics, and social responsibility did not exist; they abandoned duty and embraced hedonism. According to the French Catholic philosopher Étienne Borne, "Practical atheism is not the denial of the existence of God, but complete godlessness of action; it is a moral evil, implying not the denial of the absolute validity of the moral law but simply rebellion against that law."[2]

In the 21st century, pragmatic atheism has been seen in a more positive light. The journalist Jonathan Rauch believes that "apatheism is to be celebrated as nothing less than a major civilizational advance. Religion, as countless acts of violence in the name of God have underscored, remains the most divisive and volatile of social forces... Apatheism, therefore, should not be assumed to represent a lazy recumbency... Just the opposite: it is the product of a determined cultural effort to discipline the religious mindset, and often of an equally determined personal effort to master the spiritual passions. It is not a lapse. It is an achievement."

I do this
Absence of religious motivation

This apatheistic argument states that morals are present in human society and do not rely on religion to be a part of the human experience. Apatheists recognize that religion may provide a "comfort" for many people around the world, but apatheists do not need religion to be content with the morality of their lives and therefore live without it[citation needed]. This is known as "moral apatheism".


I do this
Indifference is better known as indifferentism, the belief that all religions are equal in value. Use of indifferentism in this context was popularized by Kant in his Critique of Pure Reason.[4] Kant argues that indifferentism represents an extreme form of skepticism that argues that there is no rational ground for accepting any philosophical position.[4] According to the Catholic Church, this type of absolute indifferentism results in a willingness to concede any position.[citation needed] It is often associated with moral relativism.

I do this shit all the time, like. The second it's their morals vs mine I realize it's pointless, because it's subjective. I respect their opinion and usually they also respect mine. We leave it at that.

Indifference is the perspective exemplified by the following statement: "Since the existence of God can never be proven, nor can it be disproven, I won't waste my time asking questions to which there are no answers."

I don't do this
Lack of evidence
This argument takes a more scientific perspective, criticizing blind faith (faith without logical evidence to support it). It argues that if a deity or deities truly wanted people to believe in them, then said deity or deities could demonstrate their existence with miracles, and explain their plan(s) for humanity or the lack thereof. Being all-powerful, if they truly wanted humans to believe, they could send a divine sign not left up to interpretation. Since they do not seem to care if humans believe or not, apatheists will not care until they show them a reason to, and perhaps not even if such an event occurred[citation needed]. (This is in essence the argument from nonbelief.)

I actually can respect some true faith.

I learned something about myself today guys.
DiPi
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Jul 27, 2012 7:33 PM #706068
Quote from Jutsu
Sheep and agnostic alert guys.

I guess technically I fall into the realm of agnostic.
I don't believe in god really but I also don't not believe.

What is the term for someone who doesn't believe and doesn't not believe but also doesn't give a fuck if god does or does not exist?
Is it like...nihilgnostic?


Maybe I should have added something more

In all these years, everyone tried to solve the questions about divine. Since both of the sides in play have valuable opinions, in the end it all revolves, as you said before, in faith

Antinomy means something whose thesis and antithesis can be both right (the general meaning, very vague), but it doesn't mean someone can't believe in the existence of god or in its non-existence

I don't think what I wrote before is agnostic, since I think that, as the existence of antinomies entails, the question we pose to ourself is wrong, not that I don't pose myself questions about it
Vorpal
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Jul 27, 2012 7:43 PM #706071
A spiritualist would tell you that you have all the right answers within yourself, you simply don't ask the right questions. Like a key without the right lock, as an example.

You're right, saying it's not possible to prove and not possible to disprove whether it does or does not exist does not make you agnostic. As I too understand that if thousands of years of humanities greatest minds can and cannot prove/disprove the existence then that means I will not find the answer through logic.

That's why I can respect faith, true faith. A true faith that understands this, someone who doesn't have to prove the existence of said deity. Because that in heart, is not too far from spiritualism and spiritualism is truly beautiful.

Though I do not claim to be a spiritualist.


Quote from MirrorsN'Mirror
It sounds like you have no faith on your god dipi.

What part of what he said makes you say that. For starters he never stated whether or whether not he even believed in god. Plus you don't have to know gods existence to believe in them.
I disagree. Him asking questions doesn't mean he doesn't have faith. Though I could be wrong, he could totally be lacking in faith.
But I don't have faith and don't not have faith and I love to discuss things like this and ask questions.
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Jul 27, 2012 7:56 PM #706078
you respect people who blindly believe in things that are ludicrous, for no other reason than someone told them they will go to fictional places after death?
Vorpal
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Jul 27, 2012 8:04 PM #706081
Quote from 2-D
you respect people who blindly believe in things that are ludicrous, for no other reason than someone told them they will go to fictional places after death?


I never said blind faith, everyone of real faith will have a dilemma during the course of their faith. And the second part of that sentence is pointless, as many different people have faith in many different things for many different reasons.
Besides I'm not saying believing in god isn't ludicrous, however, I also don't pretend that believing god existed and then caused the big bang is less fucking absurd than believing nothing existed and caused the big bang. They are both equally insane to me.

Besides, you do not need a reason for faith right? That's why atheists just blindly believe in the big bang being caused by nothing right "Or at least because they don't like god"? But they always get butt hurt when you throw the fact that atheism is more like a faith than they know.
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Jul 27, 2012 9:00 PM #706100
i think some all knowing and powerful being creating the universe and life is a lot more absurd than it just happening over an extremely long period of time, especially since that is how life works, it isn't just made in a week.
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Jul 27, 2012 9:07 PM #706105
Quote from Jutsu
less fucking absurd than believing nothing existed and caused the big bang.

The Big Bang Theory doesn't say 'something came from nothing'.
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Jul 27, 2012 9:08 PM #706106
Quote from 2-D
i think some all knowing and powerful being creating the universe and life is a lot more absurd than it just happening over an extremely long period of time, especially since that is how life works, it isn't just made in a week.

Before the universe there was no time.
What's absurd?

Quote from Fusion
The Big Bang Theory doesn't say 'something came from nothing'.

Well that's true, but the components of it's creation are unknown to science. So most simply argue that it was created by nothing, or anything that isn't god.
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