holy elemental op

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay4898787&version=1.96

Quote from _Ai_

Trees need a nerf. Maybe in cost? They should at least be completely vulnerable to air attacks. Stuns shouldn't be able to reach air units.

Not to mention that the scorpions beats crawlers 1-1. The only slight advantage that Chaos has against E is passive heal.

I second this, a tree can be gotten in the transition from early-game to mid-game. As well as being approximately the same price as a Spearton, and being much more powerful than one. The individual units it comes from are also viable enough to hold off the opposition long enough to gather enough mana to combine them.

QUOTE=fhtrg;1168191]holy elemental op

www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay4898787&version=1.96[/QUOTE]

I don't want to be an Elementals is OP screamer but I do want to point some things out. First of all let me premise by saying I have been playing Elementals since it came out. Also, I have been on a hyatus for a couple of months until the release of Elementals so I am really rusty. I have however been looking forward to trying E as it is much more cerebral.

With that said, I just wanted to share my impression from the stand point of an E user. I am beating some opponents easily that I had trouble beating as Order. You can chalk that up to people not knowing Elemental's weaknesses yet. With that said, I have met quite a few order players whom I can't beat but that is not saying much given my skill level. However I do want to point out some things, and this replay is a good example of what I want to say. This is just one example as it is the strategy that I have used: Early game, one Air unit dominates. Air>Archer and of course sword is useless. A couple of more Air units and you have snipe power over archers who are struggling to make a dent. So then that puts E way ahead on army. The only counter in early and mid game vs Air is archers, so there is already seemingly an imbalance. But here is the kicker, E can use the investment in weaker units early game to easily tech up to much stronger units while O and C are stuck with the early game units that they invested in. Several archers are about useless against a Charrog and a couple of Air units. Throw in a spear, and the Charrog wins every time while tanking for the Air while the spear is not able to tank for his archers. E wins this standoff and then starts spamming Charrogs. Now I haven't done any real tests, but I have had a Mass Charrog vs Mass Spears, and I won easily. Charrog cost 4 units while spears cost 3 but one Charrog comes awful close to beating 2 spears and 2 Charrogs vs 3 spears leaves one Charrog with almost full health. Sure Charrog cost 600+100 mana but overall Charrog dominates spears.

Chalk this up to the level I'm playing at around 1600, but I have been surprised several times at how I can get several Charrogs out as quick or quicker than my opponent can produce spears. Also, I have completely shut down several opponents with strictly air units and one Charrog.

I'm not claiming E is OP, as that really remains to be seen, however I have won multiple games and thought to myself that that was way to easy. Why am I posting this if I have Elementals? I recently played a free Order player who was quite disgruntled at loosing handily to Elementals repeatedly and his response was that this empire was going to ruin the game. He viewed Elementals as OP and a marketing scheme to pull in revenue. That statement remains to be seen however the fact that he was disgruntled at loosing handily to Elementals over and over again should be alarming. And it should be considered that I have met several players who were equally disillusioned. This game does not have a very large playing base. The majority of which play for free. Now I know those players are not pulling in any revenue but they are in fact what keeps this game alive. If you loose this free base then there is the possibility that this game may drift off of the radar.

Why am I posting this? Cause I have a genuine concern that Elementals, while firing up the dedicated supporters, may just dissolution the free base that is vital to keeping this game alive. I don't have a solution, but I offer this opinion to raise the alarm that you may want to take a much closer look and put a much greater priority at addressing this rather than taking the approach that "Elementals is OP" screamers will be dealt with. I can't say one way or the other that E is Op, but what I'm saying is all that really matters is the overwhelming impression and affect it has on the strength of this game.

Doesn't the Charrog have 8 bars of armoured health and that burrow attack that can stun something like 3 units at once?

I recently played a game as Order against the Elemental empire. Elemental seemed a bit too strong lategame in the game that I played. I had a pretty big economic advantage the whole game. I was sacrificing workers and almost had a 80 supply army. I had lots of giants, some merics, some albowtross, and a magikill. He just mind controlled some of my giants and completely crushed my army. I don't really know how to kill the "v" unit before it can do this, as the units that the treature generates seems to block the path.

Sorry if my sentence is too harsh or offensive

but I really don't understand why so many people scream at how op is elemental

Did you guys ever tried enough to find the ways to counter elemental?
this is just similar to those who always scream at how op was chaos in the past

Please also keep in mind that elementals has only been released for a few days only. Claiming an empire is very op when you lose for just a few days is just .....

I as a player for all three empires, when I used to be a 2k+ order player, I used elemental and dropped my rating to 1.9k , I even lose to low rating order players(around 1700-1800) with elementals
do you guys understand that feeling?

Before claiming how an empire is op, plz , plz , and plz at least try your best to find the solution
And if you want to disagree, feel free to challenge me, my code is 216 mysterybat, I will prove that it is possible to counter elemental

This is just same to a student to not even work hard and fail the exam, while claiming how difficult is the exam.

Haven't had much experience against the Elementals, but the Treature is highly effective for how early you can get it. It has enough health to keep spawning scropions to kill your swords whenever you attack, and its flower attack which drains health doesn't help. Archers are completely blocked by the scorpions too.

I can imagine early Shadow can quickly take out Treature. However idk the Treature's costs.

Quote from FailingAtFailing

Haven't had much experience against the Elementals, but the Treature is highly effective for how early you can get it. It has enough health to keep spawning scropions to kill your swords whenever you attack, and its flower attack which drains health doesn't help. Archers are completely blocked by the scorpions too.

the thing that I want to say is that sword and archer are not the only two units involved in SE
many other things can help , like castle archer, ninja,spearton shield wall, meric, and miner wall .

I don't want to share much here, but after I gain enough experience, for me personally, counter elemental is not difficult at all

Early ninja, that's always viable.

This is why Elemental is op. I have never won a single game vs elemental

Early game-Get a lightning to make you destroy their army, or get a treature and constantly harras.

Mid game- At this part of the game, elementals dominate. The V will control their spellcaster, you could have lots of treatures, lightnings, and other random units, and you units will dominate their units. You also have combined explosion to destroy their albowtross.

Late game- Elementals become weaker, but still very much op. If they giant mass, use the V to control them. A ninja comes, the V flashes. I think the V also does tons of damage with its clones. the elementals have weaker units compared to ninjas+albowtross, but produce them very fast.

This is what I think of the elementals so you can object these ideas.

Well, just to show what I did against Elementals with Order, here's a video. Yay!

Quote from fhtrg

This is why Elemental is op. I have never won a single game vs elemental

Early game-Get a lightning to make you destroy their army, or get a treature and constantly harras.

Mid game- At this part of the game, elementals dominate. The V will control their spellcaster, you could have lots of treatures, lightnings, and other random units, and you units will dominate their units. You also have combined explosion to destroy their albowtross.

Late game- Elementals become weaker, but still very much op. If they giant mass, use the V to control them. A ninja comes, the V flashes. I think the V also does tons of damage with its clones. the elementals have weaker units compared to ninjas+albowtross, but produce them very fast.

This is what I think of the elementals so you can object these ideas.

that is why I hate those players who use such attitude to play game. " Oh , it is op, I cannot even win once"
If you have never won a single game , it proves that your skill is at that low level, then it's your problem and you have no chance to say elemental is op.
Claiming one thing is too difficult for you instead of realizing your own problem, then it is meaningless to play the game.
Game is just a game, if not challenging and no difficulties at all, then it cannot be even considered a game.

In early game, 2 archers is enough to kill one lightning, and if not enough archers, one single archer can also kite and then escape. In the worst situation, CA can help

In mid game, if V exists, two ninjas can kill the V, one can use for chasing, and then once V teleport, the other ninja can kill. Ninjas can also kill trees and other spell units easily with only a few hits.
And albowtross can kite and split, also one single explosion is not enough to kill albowtross due to their armor. And albowtross can beat all air units.
A team of merics and archers can also work.

Late game, only noobs would do giant mass in every situation. spearton + albows, ninjas + albows, giants + albows + magkills, all are feasible combination that can rape elementals easily. If one order player lose to an elemental player in the late game, he should definitely think of his mistakes. For me, it has a very low chance for order to lose to elemental in the late game.

And also for me, the only difficulty to counter elemental is the early tree strategy in short map. I have at least won 20 games with order against elementals after elemental has been released. In contrast, when I use elemental, I have even lose to some players with much lower rating than me , at around 1700-1800 . No gain before you suffer, that is what I want to say

2 archers can barely kill 1 lightning, and lightning is just 400 gold. I just think elementals are very strong, and need a nerf, which is a suggestion.

Also, 2 ninjas can kill a V, but they probably will die before they reach the V because, well, you probably have lots of units to kill the ninjas.

In late game, giants are very common and I don't mean a straight out giant mass. the v can control the giants they have, and destroy their army. spearton/ninja+albow wont work because the combined explosion+a few airs or another one.

Quote from mysterybat

that is why I hate those players who use such attitude to play game. " Oh , it is op, I cannot even win once"
If you have never won a single game , it proves that your skill is at that low level, then it's your problem and you have no chance to say elemental is op.
Claiming one thing is too difficult for you instead of realizing your own problem, then it is meaningless to play the game.
Game is just a game, if not challenging and no difficulties at all, then it cannot be even considered a game.

In early game, 2 archers is enough to kill one lightning, and if not enough archers, one single archer can also kite and then escape. In the worst situation, CA can help

In mid game, if V exists, two ninjas can kill the V, one can use for chasing, and then once V teleport, the other ninja can kill. Ninjas can also kill trees and other spell units easily with only a few hits.
And albowtross can kite and split, also one single explosion is not enough to kill albowtross due to their armor. And albowtross can beat all air units.
A team of merics and archers can also work.

Late game, only noobs would do giant mass in every situation. spearton + albows, ninjas + albows, giants + albows + magkills, all are feasible combination that can rape elementals easily. If one order player lose to an elemental player in the late game, he should definitely think of his mistakes. For me, it has a very low chance for order to lose to elemental in the late game.

And also for me, the only difficulty to counter elemental is the early tree strategy in short map. I have at least won 20 games with order against elementals after elemental has been released. In contrast, when I use elemental, I have even lose to some players with much lower rating than me , at around 1700-1800 . No gain before you suffer, that is what I want to say

Uh, 2 archers is more expensive than a lightning, and a lightning is way more versatile with flying and speed and the fact that it can combine to form other more advanced units later, while you have to sacrifice archers to tech up to albows later (due to limited population)

Spells aren't affected by armour. An Albowtross will take about 1 bar of damage from a Magikill Blast, only surviving due to having 2 bars of health, unlike Archidons. Although, Albowtrosses are one of the most powerful air units, doesn't the Cycloid beat it easy? Haven't faced one yet, the only people I have faced mainly use Treatures, Fire and Water. I mean, the Cycloid has that tornado stun spell, and can't it attack Albowtrosses?

Another point, can't an Elemental player easily steal your Magikill with a V, while the clones do the main attacking?