Best Way to Defeat Chaos

Started by: Invincitron | Replies: 29 | Views: 1,447

uberman

Posts: 565
Joined: Dec 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 15, 2013 6:44 AM #946736
Quote from uberman
Depends on the question; how do we beat WyzDM? or how do we beat chaos?
Its not one question.

how do we beat WyzDM?
Most of us dont, if he's playing order or chaos.
I have played my chaos vs his order, and would you like to predict the result of that?

How do we beat chaos?
On short map sword rush. FULL swords, not half hearted rush.
On all others, wall and archers, add a mage ASAP, defend until you can add spears and merics, and then advance to tower.
Secure tower, get spawn and attack.


Just to expand a bit on medium or long maps -
I mean archers not castle archers and wall, secure defences behind the first wall to stop the bombs, a wall and few archers is hard to break early game as he's beating on your wall you are beating his units, and despite the order belief in OP chaos regen, it takes a long time for a jugger to heal up.
When you have a few archers, try put a wall closer to tower. Stay behind it to kill next spawn, but then mount counter attacks to try chase his wounded units from tower. If he attacks, kite back to wall.

If he breeches far wall, kite back to original wall.

Add a mage ASAP, and then a meric plus an odd spear to the defence - use spear to protect the wall, and meric will heal him so you dont lose the bomb-proof wall.

Your electric wall and blast should make it really hard for him to beat on your wall without heavy losses, and take out tower spawn with minimal trouble.

Keep trying to beat him off tower, while building a shed-load of miners behind your safe wall.

Build a giant to add some stun to the defence, each attack will now cost him a unit at least, due to stun keeping one unit from retreating.

Build an army of your choice around your giant, archers, mage, meric and spear, then attack (with tower spawn to tank the ineffective castle dead).
Unlike you, he doesnt have AOE castle archers to hit lots of your units at once, nor does he have walls to hold you stationary for his aoe spells - he cant defend anywhere near as well as you can. He has no serious counter to your Egiants, and if you keep the pressure on, your healing is far faster than his regen.

TL-DR:
Defend FIRST, set up eco, take tower, build superior army, storm his laughable 'defences' and win game
Narsheh

Posts: 198
Joined: Jan 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 15, 2013 8:11 AM #946770
Oh shoot. I forgot.

How do we counter Medusa from petrifying our Magikills?!
_Ai_
2

Posts: 11,256
Joined: Nov 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 15, 2013 8:27 AM #946774
Uberman, that's really helpful. Even reading it, I think I can beat Chaos now.
uberman

Posts: 565
Joined: Dec 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 15, 2013 8:54 AM #946786
Quote from Narsheh
Oh shoot. I forgot.

How do we counter Medusa from petrifying our Magikills?!


You dont.
You kill the medusa.
Ideally before she hits your mage (order win as chaos loss of 500/400) or after she kills a mage and is now both slow moving and defenceless for 27 sec (tie as both loss of 500/400)

Quote from _Aiman_
Uberman, that's really helpful. Even reading it, I think I can beat Chaos now.


Welcome :)

Its all to do with the subjective experience of playing the game.
An order player gets beaten, and its hard to see the skill the opponent used to do so, easy to see only the sucessful results he achieved and assume it was an easy pay-to-win victory by OP chaos. As the same applies the other way, when order wins.

Examples;
Order sees chaos perfectly micro 2 crawlers and 3 bombs to trick 4 swords into grouping tight so the bombs can kill a 4 gang of swords and order says 'chaos OP' when what they mean is 'well played' (to explain; a few seconds too late for the bombs to hit, the crawlers are all dead and the swords dispurse, a few seconds too early and the swords dont bunch up tight enough to hit them all - only perfect timing achieves the 'OP chaos' tag)
Chaos sees order use rage on crawlers and mash them before they can flee or do any significant damage (not that they could flee from the faster moving units <*chough*>) and says 'rage OP' when what they mean is .... well TBH I cant see any counter point to rage being OP, but I am ready to agree there may be one.
isgood

Posts: 568
Joined: Jan 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 15, 2013 7:08 PM #947114
you should know that order is stronger in late game, while chaos is stronger than order in early game if with good micro(because of bombers and autoheal)
Lets see some end game units of order vs chaos:
Order giants vs Chaos giants-There's a reason why there are order giant massers but no chaos giant massers. with some tanks an enslaved giant can really wreck A LOT. about 7-9 boulders kill a jugger, so if you have multiple giants and some speartons, you can easily finish off a group of juggers. Plus, bombers barely do anything to high health units( one boulder and thats death for your bomber and crawler). Meanwhile chaos giants have shlow attack rate and close range, and its attacks can be easily dodged, despite its higher damage. Also it splashs to only 3 units, thats less than a castle archer!

Majikill vs Medusa and/or marrowkai: sure, medusa autokills majikill, but majikill does more damage to the full army. Marrowkai is a joke. The reaper only targets one unit, and the hell fists barely do any damage, while poison spray poisons a lot more than venom flux, and electic wall and blast do so much more damage then hell fists and reaper.
THEFORCE
2

Posts: 1,391
Joined: Feb 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 15, 2013 7:27 PM #947126
Quote from isgood
you should know that order is stronger in late game, while chaos is stronger than order in early game if with good micro(because of bombers and autoheal)
Lets see some end game units of order vs chaos:
Order giants vs Chaos giants-There's a reason why there are order giant massers but no chaos giant massers. with some tanks an enslaved giant can really wreck A LOT. about 7-9 boulders kill a jugger, so if you have multiple giants and some speartons, you can easily finish off a group of juggers. Plus, bombers barely do anything to high health units( one boulder and thats death for your bomber and crawler). Meanwhile chaos giants have shlow attack rate and close range, and its attacks can be easily dodged, despite its higher damage. Also it splashs to only 3 units, thats less than a castle archer!

Majikill vs Medusa and/or marrowkai: sure, medusa autokills majikill, but majikill does more damage to the full army. Marrowkai is a joke. The reaper only targets one unit, and the hell fists barely do any damage, while poison spray poisons a lot more than venom flux, and electic wall and blast do so much more damage then hell fists and reaper.


Maybe marrowkai should be buffed? Like make it cheaper?
ShadowGeneralChaos
2

Posts: 2,141
Joined: Mar 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 3:22 PM #947990
Quote from THEFORCE
Maybe marrowkai should be buffed? Like make it cheaper?


well, I thought this thread is how to DEFEAT Chaos, not to HELP...
uberman

Posts: 565
Joined: Dec 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 3:27 PM #947991
Quote from ShadowGeneralChaos
well, I thought this thread is how to DEFEAT Chaos, not to HELP...


EVERY thread can be twisted to our cause, and every cause twisted to our wishes - for we are CHAOS!
jli

Posts: 988
Joined: Jan 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 3:27 PM #947993
Quote from uberman
EVERY thread can be twisted to our cause, and every cause twisted to our wishes - for we are CHAOS!


xD But IMO the reaper needs to work regardless of animation cancel.
Usman
2

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 3:44 PM #948004
THIs thread is too help order, i think the empires are enough balanced, and if u all think chaos is OP or slightly Op so think ABOUT IT! IT TAKES MONEY TO PLAY CHAOS (MONEY!) IF ITS NOT GOOD THEN WHY THE HELL WOULD EVER BUY CHAOS SO STOP ARGUING ABOUT CHAOS AND THINK ABOUT THE THIRD EMPIRE
_Ai_
2

Posts: 11,256
Joined: Nov 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 4:02 PM #948010
Quote from Horrible Death
THIs thread is too help order, i think the empires are enough balanced, and if u all think chaos is OP or slightly Op so think ABOUT IT! IT TAKES MONEY TO PLAY CHAOS (MONEY!) IF ITS NOT GOOD THEN WHY THE HELL WOULD EVER BUY CHAOS SO STOP ARGUING ABOUT CHAOS AND THINK ABOUT THE THIRD EMPIRE


Stop capslocking, and changing the size. Its annoying.

And do you realize what you are talking about? This thread is to help order to defeat Chaos, not about elemental empire.
Usman
2

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 4:20 PM #948024
ik this thread is too help order and defeat chaos, but i just said that stop thinking about this and i didnt said about elemenals just third empire! didnt go off topic for third empire, a word dosent make go off topic
_Ai_
2

Posts: 11,256
Joined: Nov 2012
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 4:43 PM #948038
Whatever bro, whatever.

On topic, sword mass + rage works for noob Chaos.
THEFORCE
2

Posts: 1,391
Joined: Feb 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 16, 2013 6:28 PM #948094
Quote from Horrible Death
ik this thread is too help order and defeat chaos, but i just said that stop thinking about this and i didnt said about elemenals just third empire! didnt go off topic for third empire, a word dosent make go off topic


Well no one said you can't make opinions to make the game better. And I think marrowkais should be buffed. Although it's off topic. But I would like to see players happy using marrowkai. For some reason, It's one of my favorite units. LOL
Galeforce
2

Posts: 149
Joined: Jan 2013
Rep: 10

View Profile
Apr 18, 2013 12:31 AM #949162
Quote from jli
Alright, I've had enough of this shit.
Someone good, like Wyz or Dae or Gale, PLEASE give us a replay of you separating your swords like a boss vs. large bomber masses and emerging victorious.
I have yet to see it done successfully on any of the Order-Chaos replays in the top list.

You keep saying it's doable, and I believe you guys, but I've never seen it work and I would like to see what black magic you people use to pull it off.


www.stickempires.com/play?replay=replay979643&version=1.60

Ta da.