Quote from DragonArcherZ

Honestly though, I've never considered "disrespecting authority" as a reason. Respect garners authority, not the other way around. You're either being flamed for the hell of it or a legitimate point is being made.

And Archy, see me in-game sometime. @Myst If you want my honest opinion, it looks like you were salty and were looking for a reason to justify a ban.

Absurd

I don't even know why you need to type so much to cover your true image

What I saw from your post could be concluded in three points :
1. Archy is a nice and cool person (which part, I never met it , he called me a noob on the first day I met him)
2. Ase and Myst hate Archy , so they banned him
3. Myst is being salty

Honest? Stop being childish and hypocritical, this is 100% biased comment with 0% supporting evidence or argument, simply because he sxxked your dxxk ??
It is reasonable or possible for people to be biased, but don't talk like you are being honest or fair, because you are never such kind of person in my mind. If Rain /Skele / Gale commented on this, I may listen a bit and take their comments into consideration. But definitely not you.

I admit I hate him(I believe 99.9% players who met Archy hated him due to his ridiculously rude and impolite manners) , and I swear I banned 2-3 of his accs permanently , dunno if anyone else shorten or cancelled the ban, or just I banned wrong accs due to his bunch of alts.
And I don't have that patience to save images and record of banning every single account.

I won't say my decision may be necessarily correct, but at least I got my supporting argument (there were records of archy swearing in global chat box, insulting others in games , got his sp forum banned ) , that means he already had a bad image in the first place.
I placed a permanent ban simply because I did not give any trust to a person with such bad history , even yourself admit that you banned him before(that means he already did something wrong in the first place, you just did not perm ban, but if that was me, I would definitely perm ban)

Also, anyone of us argue on this matter cannot get any result and is meaningless, we are all mods and in equal line, the only one that can make further judgement is CJ.


For your so-called "he is cool to talk with" part, I think these are enough to reject your "opinion"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncBybpJbr-M
http://www.stickempires.com/?replay=replay10158654&version=2.29

I said he talks shit but is a decent guy if you don't flake at every little shit said. Antagonistic without teeth, persay. You're calling more bias, and involving the whole community "hating him". No can do, yooo

Quote from DragonArcherZ

I said he talks shit but is a decent guy if you don't flake at every little shit said. Antagonistic without teeth, persay. You're calling more bias, and involving the whole community "hating him". No can do, yooo

Its more like you are passing every shit said without actually helping anything

you use a word "decent" to describe a guy who got banned couple times by different mods and calling everyone noob, very legit

Quote from mysterybat

Its more like you are passing every shit said without actually helping anything

you use a word "decent" to describe a guy who got banned couple times by different mods and calling everyone noob, very legit

Pretty much this ^

At this point I set DAZ down with Archy because they flame me equally as much, I don't consider either of you decent people.
DAZ you suck so much of Archy's dxxk Imma start shipping you with DragonArchyz.

Leave the ban. It gets rid of some of the cancer in this game.

F.Y.I. Archy did alt dodge, he never got his 1 year on it.

Lets simmer down. Theres more testosterone in here than in a woman's weight-lifting competition.

It's true that DAZ does sometimes go out of his way to flame somebody, which I disagree with completely. But seriously, reading through these posts triggered my cringe so hard. The only person talking sense right now is actually Archy.

From what I can see as an impartial viewpoint, is that Archy is actually supporting his appeal, whereas Mystery.. you're kinda just calling DAZ a 'childish shit', and saying archy must have sucked his dick, for simply expressing his own opinion...

If you want to actually convince people other than Ase, (who was conveniently your 'partner of discussion' in the other flamey thread), you need to actually provide harder evidence. Having previous alts banned for a day or whatever isn't a good enough reason.

Unfortunately Im not a mod so I can't unban him, but I support his appeal and think that somebody else should.

Edit: Don't take anything of what I said personally (as I know it will be).

Quote from Zomar

Lets simmer down. Theres more testosterone in here than in a woman's weight-lifting competition.

It's true that DAZ does sometimes go out of his way to flame somebody, which I disagree with completely. But seriously, reading through these posts triggered my cringe so hard. The only person talking sense right now is actually Archy.

From what I can see as an impartial viewpoint, is that Archy is actually supporting his appeal, whereas Mystery.. you're kinda just calling DAZ a 'childish shit', and saying archy must have sucked his dick, for simply expressing his own opinion...

If you want to actually convince people other than Ase, (who was conveniently your 'partner of discussion' in the other flamey thread), you need to actually provide harder evidence. Having previous alts banned for a day or whatever isn't a good enough reason.

Unfortunately Im not a mod so I can't unban him, but I support his appeal and think that somebody else should.

I agree with your part that my words were not appropriate. But when DAZ used the same word "salty" everytime he saw me (I saw this word from him for at least 5 times in recently) , it was simply annoying.
I met him in IRC recently, and I can safely say that he never likes me , same for my situation, so our judgement/comments on each other are simply personal issues only. (irrelevant here)

Of course for the "sxxx dxxx" part, I was simply describing how he defended a guy with bad history without valid reason.

And also, before considering an appeal, what you need first is to look his argument. What he said was just that "he did not break any rules", and so he should not get banned now.
But my point is, he broke the rules couple months ago, which should be permanent banned in the first place. And all arguments or appeal right now should not exist.

Besides, 90% or more of my ban is one week or more, I don't give one day ban, let alone to say one hour ban. Whenever I put a ban, its simply because the spam/bad language go too far from tolerance.
I used to try record my first 30 bans, but right after that I realized I have to ban more than ~20 everytime I come online, so I gave up that work.

Also, even if any mod unban him, I will still ban him again . It is purely decision difference, any mod cannot judge another mod 100% , if you want a further judgement , that will be from the devs.

p.s zomar you should be a mod tho

Quote from mysterybat

But when DAZ used the same word "salty" everytime he saw me (I saw this word from him for at least 5 times in recently) , it was simply annoying.

Honestly, it's the vibe you're giving off because..

Quote from mysterybat

But my point is, he broke the rules couple months ago, which should be permanent banned in the first place. And all arguments or appeal right now should not exist.

He 'broke the rules' (alt dodging?) a couple of months ago.. Its fishy that he was only banned now; you can't deny there isn't a linkage with that other thread.

Also I think the fact that it was a 'couple of months ago' would surely mean that the ban is now obsolete. He isn't causing trouble anymore, so it just seems unnecessary.

P.S @Archy Do you even care about being banned from global chat? Or are you just trying to call Myst out? I'm not disagreeing with anything you've said, I just don't understand your motive - most people (like you) couldn't care less about speaking on the global.

Quote from Zomar

Honestly, it's the vibe you're giving off because..

He 'broke the rules' (alt dodging?) a couple of months ago.. Its fishy that he was only banned now; you can't deny there isn't a linkage with that other thread.

Also I think the fact that it was a 'couple of months ago' would surely mean that the ban is now obsolete. He isn't causing trouble anymore, so it just seems unnecessary.

P.S @Archy Do you even care about being banned from global chat? Or are you just trying to call Myst out? I'm not disagreeing with anything you've said, I just don't understand your motive - most people (like you) couldn't care less about speaking on the global.

DAZ called me being salty, I called him being childish, that's it
again, it is my personal issue with him, don't need to intrude, and is completely irrelevant to this issue. Let's stop discussing it

---
It is fishy because I don't even come SE everyday like I used to be, and I also lose my membership and cannot check back the record.
And I did not see him on live replay until yesterday in global chat, that's it.

Also I find it hard to agree with your obsolete point. If you are saying something like this, it is just like I am saying all those past cheaters/hackers (eg Terrential, Max) should all get unbanned due to obsolete punishment
What is the point of one year ban if it can be "obsolete" in just few months?

Quote from mysterybat

DAZ called me being salty, I called him being childish, that's it
again, it is my personal issue with him, don't need to intrude, and is completely irrelevant to here. Let's stop discussing it

---
It is fishy because I don't even come SE everyday like I used to be, and I also lose my membership and cannot check back the record.
And I only saw him live replay until yesterday in global chat, that's it.

Im not talking about you and DAZ.

And yes, you don't come on SE that often. *fishiness level goes up* You also said you'll go through the effort of banning him if ever he gets unbanned. *fishiness level goes of the charts*...You're digging yourself a hole.

At this point, there's only really yourself and Ase who are justifying each other's actions. Considering everybody else is sort of disagreeing with you, might as well call it case closed. If you're going to keep banning him, thats not my problem, I just wanted to voice my opinion.

Edit (he made an edit): You weren't completely clear on what his initial punishment was, but I don't think it's as severe as hacking. He's clearly not doing it anymore.. People can get let out of jail prematurely for showing correct behaviour you know.

Quote from Zomar

Im not talking about you and DAZ.

And yes, you don't come on SE that often. *fishiness level goes up* You also said you'll go through the effort of banning him if ever he gets unbanned. *fishiness level goes of the charts*...You're digging yourself a hole.

At this point, there's only really yourself and Ase who are justifying each other's actions. Considering everybody else is sort of disagreeing with you, might as well call it case closed. If you're going to keep banning him, thats not my problem, I just wanted to voice my opinion.

Do you understand my point?

I said I'll go through the effort because that is my decision, why I have to follow other mods' decision(if any mod is going to unban him) ?
Do you mean because some mods disagree with another mod's decision, they can take actions without even any discussion ?
You talk like other mods can simply cancel each others' decision randomly and easily.

"everybody else" , those "everybody" that I see so far is only you and DAZ, still two people only.

I don't want to make things complicated , my conclusion can be summed up like this :

1) I banned him before, and it was supposed to be one year ban, I did not know why he could still exist in global chat, so I added back the ban yesterday
2) There is never a point "obsolete" in my mind, if someone got a year ban, or ever alt dodge(which he actually did), the ban should continue.
3) You can put a doubt on me, but that's just a doubt, and it cannot change anything.
4) If you really want a further investigation , my suggestion is either make a poll for all mods to vote, or hand the case to CJ

Quote from mysterybat

Do you understand my point?
I said I'll go through the effort because that is my decision, why I have to follow other mods' decision(if any mod is going to unban him) ?

Your point seems to be "I did it because it's my decision and you don't have the right to question it". You now brought up the fact that you were previously meant to 1-year ban him (better late than never), but I'm still questioning the validity of this ban - but you seem to be dodging it in all ways possible.

Quote from mysterybat

Do you mean because some mods disagree with another mod's decision, they can take actions without even any discussion ?
You talk like other mods can simply cancel each others' decision randomly and easily.

It's being discussed.

Quote from mysterybat

"everybody else" , those "everybody" that I see so far is only you and DAZ, still two people only.

Gale. Lewis doubted the credibility. Not everyone posted on the thread too.

Quote from mysterybat

hand the case to CJ

Good joke. Why shouldn't the mods/community be capable of handling it themselves? Especially if there is a distinctive majority/minority.

I see where you're trying to come from, but it's all too wishy-washy.. I mean, we have no way to know if you did want to 1-year ban him a few months ago. Im not saying I 100% dont believe you, I'm just leaning towards what seems like the most plausible explanation to me . Doesnt mean its right or wrong.

Going to end this anti-climatic discussion and wait to see what others think.

Mystery you are really showing your true colors for everyone to see. Like DAZ said I am a decent guy. The only thing I am really guilty of is calling people noobs... Which is such a small insult compared to all the thing I could say. Lol players like Alternate make personal attacks and threats on my mother every time I beat him. If anyone says I'm not a decent person than they are either Ase or you haven't talked to me directly. Feel free to talk to me about anything Entrovert 441. I'm well versed on many subjects, leveled headed and down to earth. The whole reason you hate me Mystery is cause I called you a noob? Even though at the time you were ranked #1 in DM and classic? I have no idea why you took it to heart. Instead of being emotional and crying about it just call me a noob back... Simple as that. The reason I talk trash is cause I want others to talk trash back. I don't talk trash to put others down and to make them feel bad, if I did I would use much harsher words than "noob".

Quote from mysterybat

I admit I hate him(I believe 99.9% players who met Archy hated him due to his ridiculously rude and impolite manners) , and I swear I banned 2-3 of his accs permanently , dunno if anyone else shorten or cancelled the ban, or just I banned wrong accs due to his bunch of alts.
And I don't have that patience to save images and record of banning every single account.

Yeah we know you hate me, which is why you lied and made this whole thing up. No one else shorted or cancelled any ban, because there wasn't one to begin with. There were no appeal put in so it would be impossible for someone else to cancel or shorten it. I will stay firm on saying that NONE
of my accounts are perm banned and that you lied and made all this up. And I will continue to call you what you are, a liar.

Quote from mysterybat

I agree with your part that my words were not appropriate. But when DAZ used the same word "salty" everytime he saw me (I saw this word from him for at least 5 times in recently) , it was simply annoying.

I met him in IRC recently, and I can safely say that he never likes me , same for my situation, so our judgement/comments on each other are simply personal issues only. (irrelevant here)

Of course for the "sxxx dxxx" part, I was simply describing how he defended a guy with bad history without valid reason.

This is just evidence that you are too emotional and don't know how to control you anger when you get mad. Definitely a quality a mod shouldn't have.

Quote from mysterybat

And also, before considering an appeal, what you need first is to look his argument. What he said was just that "he did not break any rules", and so he should not get banned now.
But my point is, he broke the rules couple months ago, which should be permanent banned in the first place. And all arguments or appeal right now should not exist.

And I'm saying that you're claim that you perm banned multiple of my account is false and is a complete lie. You provided NOTHING to prove these statements are true, no account names, no legit time frame, no screenshots and no explanation on what I did to deserve a perm ban. I assure you, if you would have perm banned me I would have appealed but no appeal was submitted cause it never happened. I submitted screenshots of the last three accounts I played on, which dates back to before you even became a Mod, and guess what? They weren't banned like I've been saying through this whole appeal process.

Quote from mysterybat

Also, even if any mod unban him, I will still ban him again . It is purely decision difference, any mod cannot judge another mod 100% , if you want a further judgement , that will be from the devs.

Mystery this is the exact reason you REALLY shouldn't be a Mod. You contradict yourself Mystery, you say a Mod can't judge another but you just said you would undo a judgement from another mod. Multiple Mods have agreed with me and said that I was wrongfully banned. The fact that you would continue to ban me makes this whole appeal process counterproductive. If you can't own up and admit that you are wrong, and you admit that you will continue to wrongfully ban then you really do need your Modding abilities stripped.

Quote from Zomar

Your point seems to be "I did it because it's my decision and you don't have the right to question it". You now brought up the fact that you were previously meant to 1-year ban him (better late than never), but I'm still questioning the validity of this ban - but you seem to be dodging it in all ways possible.

It's being discussed.


Gale. Lewis doubted the credibility. Not everyone posted on the thread too.


Good joke. Why shouldn't the mods/community be capable of handling it themselves? Especially if there is a distinctive majority/minority.

I see where you're trying to come from, but it's all too wishy-washy.. I mean, we have no way to know if you did want to 1-year ban him a few months ago. Im not saying I 100% dont believe you, I'm just leaning towards what seems like the most plausible explanation to me . Doesnt mean its right or wrong.

Going to end this anti-climatic discussion and wait to see what others think.

1) You have the right to question it, but question it ? validity? I never saw your question. And I repeat my points "3 times" already
He alt dodged after his banned, he had tons of alts, and he had history of insulting mods (me + Ai + Ase) + insulting tons of players in games + breaking chat box rules

And so-far what points did you mention? No , you just put doubt and questioned, but you did not have your own supporting argument
What I saw from DAZ was simply that he disliked me and calling archy decent
And your point is simply "fishy" + "putting a doubt on me" + "the ban was old , you do not see any trouble now, so it should be unbanned"

None of your points were supported with direct rules-related stuffs. Pure personal doubt

2) Yes, that's why I am discussing with you guys, but before any conclusion being made, don't talk about unban stuff.

3) Gale/Lewis doubt, tell them to just find me directly or post here. It does not help by saying anything behind.

4) Not a joke at all. Yes, I am just mentioning a possibility (because you guys are asking for an appeal). And not all mods come here.
It is just a possible solution, mods are the 2nd level in the administration , if you disagree with mods while the majority cannot come up with a conclusion, then this is the only way to go.

When we cannot come up with a conclusion while you guys insist for the appeal, you have any better suggestions other than the two that I mentioned ? If not, stop blaming my suggestion.

--------

Quote from ArchyBeatz

Mystery you are really showing your true colors for everyone to see. Like DAZ said I am a decent guy. The only thing I am really guilty of is calling people noobs... Which is such a small insult compared to all the thing I could say. Lol players like Alternate make personal attacks and threats on my mother every time I beat him. If anyone says I'm not a decent person than they are either Ase or you haven't talked to me directly. Feel free to talk to me about anything Entrovert 441. I'm well versed on many subjects, leveled headed and down to earth. The whole reason you hate me Mystery is cause I called you a noob? Even though at the time you were ranked #1 in DM and classic? I have no idea why you took it to heart. Instead of being emotional and crying about it just call me a noob back... Simple as that. The reason I talk trash is cause I want others to talk trash back. I don't talk trash to put others down and to make them feel bad, if I did I would use much harsher words than "noob".



Yeah we know you hate me, which is why you lied and made this whole thing up. No one else shorted or cancelled any ban, because there wasn't one to begin with. There were no appeal put in so it would be impossible for someone else to cancel or shorten it. I will stay firm on saying that NONE
of my accounts are perm banned and that you lied and made all this up. And I will continue to call you what you are, a liar.





This is just evidence that you are too emotional and don't know how to control you anger when you get mad. Definitely a quality a mod shouldn't have.



And I'm saying that you're claim that you perm banned multiple of my account is false and is a complete lie. You provided NOTHING to prove these statements are true, no account names, no legit time frame, no screenshots and no explanation on what I did to deserve a perm ban. I assure you, if you would have perm banned me I would have appealed but no appeal was submitted cause it never happened. I submitted screenshots of the last three accounts I played on, which dates back to before you even became a Mod, and guess what? They weren't banned like I've been saying through this whole appeal process.



Mystery this is the exact reason you REALLY shouldn't be a Mod. You contradict yourself Mystery, you say a Mod can't judge another but you just said you would undo a judgement from another mod. Multiple Mods have agreed with me and said that I was wrongfully banned. The fact that you would continue to ban me makes this whole appeal process counterproductive. If you can't own up and admit that you are wrong, and you admit that you will continue to wrongfully ban then you really do need your Modding abilities stripped.

This sentence ruins my idea to give any more comments to you

"The reason I talk trash is cause I want others to talk trash back"

Quote from Zomar

P.S @Archy Do you even care about being banned from global chat? Or are you just trying to call Myst out? I'm not disagreeing with anything you've said, I just don't understand your motive - most people (like you) couldn't care less about speaking on the global.

I actually do Zomar. While I don't talk in global chat very often, I play the game enough to want the ability to talk in global when I choose. With that being a minor reason why I submitted the appeal the main reasons are because he is straight up lying. He never perm banned any of my accounts so I'm going to defend myself against those false claims. On top of that, if the other Mods and community allows Mystery to get away with this, than this will get out of control in the future. Not only will Mystery lie and pull another stunt like this other Mods will start doing it as well. "As long as I lie and that say I perm banned an alt a long time ago, I can ban anyone I want for up to a year." More information and proof needs to be provided if Mods are going to go about banning people in that manner.

Quote from mysterybat

This sentence ruins my idea to give any more comments to you

"The reason I talk trash is cause I want others to talk trash back"

As for Mystery, I wouldn't expect you to say much more. You lied yourself into a tight little corner, there's not a whole lot you can say at this point.

Not bother to comment on the post above me(someone who already made an epic sentence that showed how ridiculous he is)

Just want to add couple points here

1) I said I perm banned before, and right now I have no membership, so I cannot check back those of his alts.

2) Same for the boy who talked about "lie" before, I can say he is lying as well. So what, I want to prove I made perm banned before , and he doesn't need to make the proof he did not get any of his alts unbanned ?
Make it fair, if anyone of you want to put a doubt on my claimed decision made before , you should also make the proof on your appeal for your own sake.

It does not make sense for a mod to make proof on any single ban, but the one who appealed gave no proof at all.
Unless you are making a comprehensive list of alts that he owned before, and showed that none were perm banned, otherwise you are all just making pure one-sided doubt on me.

Otherwise I can use the same sentence to any of you , "you are lying"

3) "Even" I did not perm ban him before , does not mean I cannot year ban him now. There are no contradictions , just like, you banned someone who spammed for one day , after one day he spammed more hard , you still one day ban him ??

If I saw nothing in the past few days, I might still reserve the possibility of cancelling the ban. But what I saw was still most of his replays were insulting others, and most of his sentences/posts were creating a huge trouble/arguments.

4) I expect anyone to actually convince me or discuss with me through rules-based arguments, not personal doubts + biased. Those vid+replays that I gave out so far was just to show that the image of archy in front of me.

Finally, repeat once more, it does not make sense to put a doubt on a chat ban by simply asking me for proof, while not giving any proof on your own appeal.
It is just like, a person caught by police accusing of possible committing crimes, the person had to make proof for himself in the first place, not to ask the court for proof .

5) My strengthened point were "He did insulted mods" "He did trash talk" "He insulted others in games" "He got the history of getting banned"

Quoting from the rules
Impersonation - Imitating a mod/authority figure
Swearing/Cursing - Excessive use of rude words
Flaming - Directly attacking a person/player
Dodging - Being banned on an account - use alt to dodge

The dodging part alone that happened was more than enough for everything

-----

Imagine what happened if every single player who got banned before coming here saying I need to give a proof, what would happen?