Turn it into a giant via further tech upgrades, don't change the tree unit right now, just add like another tree growth upgrade.
Simply growing the tree would be more boring for the gameplay. Anyway this ties in below.
Sorry to be so ignorant, but what exactly do you mean by "single unit responses"? I think eles have enough "reactive gameplay".
Hell no. Let me contrast OvC and OvE for you
OvC micro
OvC chaos brings in bombs and order has to split
Order brings in a mage and chaos has to try to focus it down
Chaos brings in a spellcaster, now Order must do loads of things differently to protect its archers
Chaos brings out deads, now Order must avoid getting sniped by poison
Chaos player reaps a spear, Order player should toggle shield wall
Chaos player reaps a Mage, Order player should make that Mage cast a spell just before reap
+ loads of micro at start with swords and cats
These are all micro responses that force the other player to do something in response to the opponent, usually centred around one unit on both sides.
OvE micro
Ele player has to avoid archidon sniping on fires IF ele player has ran out of loads of tanks for some reason
Ele player has to micro their V to keep it alive
Order player has to split units up when attacking the ele player' base
Order player has to move entire/most army if ele player casts an inferno spell or tries to use scorch
Most of those are less likely to happen than in OvC and there's far less of them and far less micro, excluding the V, to do.
For example, if the ele player forces the order player into submission via infernos or tree, then you use ninjas or mages to take care of the problem if that's what you mean by reactive gameplay and counters.
That's a macro counter, which ele does actually have some of, not a micro response. Ele doesn't involve much micro unless you use Vs and then Order still isn't doing much mcico.
If that's not what you meant I again apologize for my ignorance.
Yeah I should have explained myself more clearly the first time rather than throw a new word into the discussion.
I sort of understand what you're trying to achieve though, and how are you going to make the matchup like OvC and not make the empire more like order or chaos? These changes would be unnecessary plus OvE has all these things. Judging by what you've been suggesting earlier, I may have had a good reason to believe you're trying to make it a little more like order and chaos.
Because on one side of the matchup it's friggin ele. That means so many different things for the gameplay. If ele actually fights Order and Chaos at the start game with Earths we can see the earth recycling into miners trick that made ele require some more micro and timing to get them back to base. Ele will have to react to poison in totally different ways to how Order and Chaos do, ele has no way to insta kill spell casters which changes the entire dynamic and forces ele to do different things in response to those. We might see strategic unit combining to remove a poison DoT in response to a dead snipe or magikill during the mid game when ele doesn't have the resources to throw on using a water to cure 2 units.
1. you want to give trees extra hp to combat giants,
I've said why, so ele has a macro option to respond to giants. Yes this would make ele a little similar to Chaos and Order, but that's because having no giant unit makes late game rather difficult. Sure, I want ele's late game to be more similar to Chaos and Order, ele doesn't have a late game right now.
2. you want to decrease charrog hp to make it more like spearton I think, and didn't you think of an armour upgrade?
Charrogs will never be like spears. They have a larger hitbox, which is half the reason ele doesn't have to manouver units around to stop sniping, and also charrogs are extremely counter sword and counter cat with their AoE. Nerf the Charrog hp and what you have is a skirmish unit, unlike the Order unmoving frontline tank or the Chaos initiator.
3. you suggested fires to have faster projectiles like archers.
To clarify I meant faster vertically so fires at least work against air units. Fires are never going to be like archers because their horizontal range sucks and they can't snipe units just behind the enemy front line because they don't have enough range.
4. you also suggested they change airs to combat air units like albows and wings.
Isn't the point of an Air unit to fight Air units? Wings are fast, albows are slow, and airs are weird and neither fast nor slow. Wings and albows can only attack the enemy unit at the front where as airs can target whatever they like. Air mass versus eclipsor mass, if airs were able to cope in such a scenario, would look very different because of the way targeting works to eclipsors versus albows.
You aren't giving anywhere NEAR enough credit to ele where it's already super different to the other empires. Making it more able to constantly fight them like in OvC won't make ele the same as Order or Chaos except in terms of making the matchup interesting.
I don't disagree with giant tree but I disagree with the reasons. If eles ever needed extra extra tank they have a ts2, so maybe they should change that instead. Even in order I rarely see giants anymore, even after the 10:00 mark. Chaos maybe a little more.
I've given you the reasons. It's not to make ele more similar to Chaos and Order, it's to make ele's differences translate into micro. Just because giants are rare doesn't mean its a phase of the game that needs no balance. Ele will not just conveniently have tower whenever the hell they need an extra tank, that's absurd.
